Hey y'all and thanks for checking out our Accio... Something Else episode! A huge thanks to Adal Rifai (from Hey Riddle Riddle and Hello from the Magic Tavern) and Zach (from My Cabbages!) for joining me for this episode. Here's our Big Fuckin List of Shit You Should Watch/Read/Play/Listen To. I've added links to where you can find this stuff -- streaming links work in America but if you're abroad no guarantees.
What's up, Pott-heads? Welcome to The Restricted Section. It's me, your girl, Christina. I'm fucking stoked to be here today presenting to you probably my favorite episode of this podcast of all time. I'm sorry that, until now, it's been on our Patreon bonus episode feed. I just had to share it with everyone because it is so fucking delightful (brag). Please get ready for . . . My Immortal! The legendary Harry Potter fanfiction by . . . someone. If you've never heard of this before, don't worry, because Haley does a great job of explaining it all. Just sit back, buckle up, and get ready for a fucking wild ride.
But before we do, huge shoutout to all of our Patreon supporters. They're the reason we're able to do—well, anything, first of all—but they're also the reason we do these really fun bonus episodes that cover a lot of the extra material in the Harry Potter universe. So huge shoutout to our Patreon supporters. Thank you so much for everything you do. Love you!
And last thing before we get started: just a content warning for pretty much everything (as user Alkeno says at that link: “everything, usually depression, suicide, self harm, drug use, depression, homophobia, transphobia, abuse of clothes from hot topic”). These subjects are discussed in a way that’s juvenile and it’s often quite funny, all framed in this very ridiculous context. You know us: we don't really get into it. But it's sort of hard to avoid all of the touchy subject matter. If you have any questions about the content before listening or reading, please feel free to reach out.
And now I present my favorite episode of anything ever: the Restricted Section’s take on what is widely regarded as the worst fanfic of all time, My Immortal.
Christina Kann 02:41
Welcome to a very special Restricted Section bonus episode--
Haley Simpkiss 02:54
AHEM! I'm Haley. And look at me. Look at me. Look at me. I am the host now. We're talking about My Immortal.
Christina Kann 03:06
God save us. There's some pretty ambient thunderstorms going on in the background, the doom and gloom. I think—oh my god, what is her name?
Haley Simpkiss 03:15
Ebony Dark’ness Dementia Raven Way? It's very goffick outside.
Christina Kann 03:22
Yes, it's gothic. I think Ebony would like it.
Brooke Matherly 03:25
It's Ebony, but it's not spelled correctly.
Christina Kann 03:28
Hey, wait, wait, stop. We have to introduce ourselves. That's Haley. She stole the show. Brooke, there you are. I'm glad you're here.
Brooke Matherly 03:38
Christina Kann 03:41
Is this a punishment? Is this a blessing? We are also delighted to be joined today by Zach, one of the cohosts of My Cabbages! Hello, Zach.
Zach of Cabbs 03:50
How's it going? Let's get drunk and talk about goth wizards.
Christina Kann 03:55
Before we get started, I do have a lined piece of paper laying on my desk in my official podcasting notebook, which is a thing that I have. And at the top, it just says "My Immortal Drinking Game," but the list is completely empty. So as things progress, we'll add to this drinking game.
Brooke Matherly 04:16
How bad do we want that drinking game to put people in terms of like, "Wow, this is fun and we're drunk!" to "You died two chapters in"?
Zach of Cabbs 04:26
The gradient we're going for is: by the end of this show, any passage read should cause everyone to continue drinking.
Haley Simpkiss 04:33
Don't worry too much about us, Brooke, because there's a lot to unpack here. Anytime you talk about My Immortal—widely regarded as the worst fanfiction ever written—there are three things you have to discuss. You obviously have to discuss the fic itself, which is a nightmare. But there's also a lot of lore, about 15 years' worth.
Zach of Cabbs 04:58
The anime is better.
Haley Simpkiss 05:02
Anything would be better than this, presumably. My Immortal came out in 2006-2007. There's a longstanding mystery bordering on full-blown conspiracy theory surrounding the authorship of this fanfiction. And then, of course, you have to discuss the ultimate question: Was this funny on purpose, or is it just bad? I'm just going to start with initial impressions. Do we think this is a troll? Yes or no?
Christina Kann 05:39
Zach of Cabbs 05:40
God, it's so hard. I feel like it's Tommy Wiseau’s career. It began in earnest, and once the person realized that writing bad was getting them attention, it became a troll as it went along. It's just so hard. I mean, I've never been a teen girl before, so maybe you all can shed some light on this.
Brooke Matherly 06:03
Harder than Draco's hypothetical cock.
Zach of Cabbs 06:08
His “boy thing.” Excuse you.
Brooke Matherly 06:10
Ugh. Haley, I have a question for you. You've read this multiple times, correct?
Haley Simpkiss 06:16
I will make a confession. I have trouble getting past Chapter 15 or 16 for reasons we'll discuss. At a certain point, it becomes physically difficult to read. I was made aware of My Immortal when it was still being updated back in the day, so I’ve been following this whole mystery surrounding it for this entire time. This fanfiction is my Lindbergh baby, and my soul will not rest until I know the truth.
Brooke Matherly 06:53
But in a perverted way, you would say you enjoy this? This fanfic?
Christina Kann 06:59
We do this all the time on Movie Night Crew. It's so bad that we had a good time. We were talking about Nicolas Cage before this started.
Brooke Matherly 07:05
No. No, no, no. The reason I'm asking Haley these questions is because you made me read this, and I don't want to ever fucking hear another word about Cats (2019) ever again in my goddamn life.
Haley Simpkiss 07:17
You consented, Brooke! You consented to do this bonus episode. I warned you.
Christina Kann 07:23
At some point, we have to stop talking about Cats (2019).
Haley Simpkiss 07:28
Again, I have never managed to read My Immortal all the way through. I just like that it exists. You guys didn't have to read it all the way through.
Christina Kann 07:37
I did read it all the way through.
Brooke Matherly 07:39
We will watch and listen to the first 10 songs of Cats (2019) on a semi-regular basis until you start enjoying it.
Haley Simpkiss 07:44
I'm just going to go ahead and read the first paragraph for you guys.
Christina Kann 07:48
Wait, I want to defend my impulsive “No.” This is not a troll. Two things. One: I've seen writing like this. I've seen actual people who wanted to become actual authors who write exactly like this, with this amount of care and attention.
Zach of Cabbs 08:02
Christina Kann 08:03
Absolutely. And two: I have been a teenage girl before, and while I don't fully understand the lengths to which these characters act, I could see something of myself in some of these choices. My 15-year-younger self.
Brooke Matherly 08:23
I don't think their writing style is too dissimilar for the age gap to the original 50 Shades of Grey when it was being posted online. Accounting for the supposed age of what I'm assuming is a late-middle-school girl versus a fully grown adult woman writing a Twilight fanfic, I think the writing style choices and gratuitous use of sex is completely the same between these two franchises.
Haley Simpkiss 08:54
Yep. So for the uninitiated, My Immortal is ostensibly a Harry Potter fanfiction.
Zach of Cabbs 09:03
There's a big quotation mark fingers around "Harry Potter fanfic."
Christina Kann 09:09
Wait, can I go ahead and make a rule? Let's drink every time we say “Harry Potter,” because I don't think it's gonna be a lot.
Haley Simpkiss 09:16
Well, his name is Vampire in this.
Christina Kann 09:18
Exactly. I think we should drink every time we say “Harry Potter.”
Zach of Cabbs 09:22
Thanks to Christina, I just had to take three drinks in a row.
Brooke Matherly 09:26
This felt like reading a teen version of Harriet Porber by Chuck Tingle for as much as it related to the actual Harry Potter series.
Christina Kann 09:33
Yeah, but that book was so well done.
Zach of Cabbs 09:35
There were so many times that I was reading a passage and felt like, if I was trying to write a purposefully bad thing for comedy, I would misspell this word this way, because I would find it funny. "Triumelephantly"? I mean, come on.
Christina Kann 09:50
Wait, Zack, that is so funny. I read literally all of this fanfic today, and every single error, I thought, "Someone could make this error," until I got to literally exactly the error you just read, and I was like "This is too good to be true."
Zach of Cabbs 10:05
“Triumelephantly.” There's no fucking possible way that it was was written in earnest
Christina Kann 10:09
Unless it was a very elaborate autocorrect failure, and the word "elephant" got in there somehow.
Zach of Cabbs 10:17
Are you saying Tara's spelling is just so awful that she's literally broken her spellchecker? Her spellchecker has been traumatized.
Brooke Matherly 10:25
I can also see it being somewhat intentional given the cutesy substitutions she makes in other aspects, where she'll say things like "fangs" instead of "thanks."
Haley Simpkiss 10:35
A lot of that is like leetspeak from back in the day.
Christina Kann 10:39
That kind of shit, like "fangs" instead of "thanks," is exactly something I would have done when I was younger. When I was in middle school, every time I wanted to say the word "and," I would drop two ampersands instead of saying "and." && it had to be two. That was my thing.
Brooke Matherly 10:51
I exclusively spelled "love" L-U-V for a very long time and contended it that was different from L-O-V-E, because L-O-V-E was romantic but L-U-V was for my friends and family.
Christina Kann 11:03
Zach of Cabbs 11:05
For a few years of my life, every time I said "anybody," I would say "anypony." I don't want to talk about it; let's just move on.
Haley Simpkiss 11:14
Zach of Cabbs 11:20
Let that float down the River Styx where it belongs.
Haley Simpkiss 11:24
Let's discuss the plot of My Immortal insofar as there is any kind of a plot in My Immortal. The main character is Ebony Dark'ness Dementia Raven Way.
Zach of Cabbs 11:36
She's Klingon. That's my headcanon. That's why there's an apostrophe.
Haley Simpkiss 11:40
Oh no, she's a vampire, a Slytherin, and a goth, and she goes to Hogwarts, kind of. But everyone at Hogwarts is also a goth and/or a vampire, but some of them are also posers. Voldemort tells her to kill Vampire Potter—Harry has changed his name.
Christina Kann 12:03
We have to drink. You said "Harry" and "Potter."
Zach of Cabbs 12:05
In the same sentence, that counts.
Haley Simpkiss 12:07
Harry Potter has changed his name to Vampire Potter, and his scar is now a pentagram.
Christina Kann 12:13
I think we should drink every time we say "pentagram."
Zach of Cabbs 12:15
You're trying to kill us this early?
Brooke Matherly 12:18
I mean, if we're really trying to die, just how about every time we say the word "black"?
Zach of Cabbs 12:24
Brooke Matherly 12:25
Oh, for sure at least a sip for every time someone's outfit is described.
Haley Simpkiss 12:32
Those are the most coherent parts!
Christina Kann 12:37
They were so lucid writing those outfit descriptions.
Brooke Matherly 12:39
It's a complete tonal change.
Haley Simpkiss 12:41
It’s true. The whole thing is completely impenetrable. There's time travel. Marty McFly turns up at one point. Nothing makes sense. All of the adults are pedophiles for some reason. But anytime she's describing her outfit, it is in lovingly crafted detail. If you have not read this somehow, I just want to give you guys a taste of what the style is. I'm just going to read the first paragraph.
Hi my name is Ebony Dark’ness Dementia Raven Way and I have long ebony black hair (that’s how I got my name) with purple streaks and red tips that reaches my mid-back and icy blue eyes like limpid tears and a lot of people tell me I look like Amy Lee (AN: if u don’t know who she is get da hell out of here!). I’m not related to Gerard Way but I wish I was because he’s a major fucking hottie. I’m a vampire but my teeth are straight and white. I have pale white skin. I’m also a witch, and I go to a magic school called Hogwarts in England where I’m in the seventh year (I’m seventeen). I’m a goth (in case you couldn’t tell) and I wear mostly black. I love Hot Topic and I buy all my clothes from there. For example today I was wearing a black corset with matching lace around it and a black leather miniskirt, pink fishnets and black combat boots. I was wearing black lipstick, white foundation, black eyeliner and red eye shadow. I was walking outside Hogwarts. It was snowing and raining so there was no sun, which I was very happy about. A lot of preps stared at me. I put up my middle finger at them.
Haley Simpkiss 14:29
The whole thing is like that.
Christina Kann 14:31
When you said it was raining and there was no sun, thunder clapped outside.
Zach of Cabbs 14:38
Oh my god. There's definitely thunder rolling in my part of town right now.
Haley Simpkiss 14:47
We are obviously going to discuss the fic itself. We're gonna get into it, but it's going to get very chaotic very fast.
Christina Kann 15:06
Haley, you're so hot when you present a subject you're obsessed with. You're at your best right now.
Haley Simpkiss 15:14
Allow me to info dump. *pulls out many index cards*
Zach of Cabbs 15:15
*gasp* Those are note cards.
Haley Simpkiss 15:17
Yes, they are.
Zach of Cabbs 15:18
Folks, Haley has prepared a presentation that we are all about to be graced with.
Christina Kann 15:25
She's fanning her index cards.
Zach of Cabbs 15:27
I feel like Spongebob in the episode where he's eating his own arms when Squidward's describing the Hash-Slinging Slasher.
Haley Simpkiss 15:38
Let's just start with the facts. My Immortal was uploaded to fanfiction.net in 2006-2007. It was published by an author called xxxbloodyrists666xxx, aka Tara Gillespie. It is 22,700 words, insofar as we can call any of these words.
Zach of Cabbs 16:05
What do you count as a word?
Haley Simpkiss 16:08
Philosophical question. There are 44 chapters, but Chapter 39 was apparently written by a hacker. The fanfiction was deleted in 2008, and the account was likely hacked not long after in 2009. An attempt was made to "recover" the account, which may also have been a hacker. There is a supposed sequel called My Immortal 2: Wake Me Up Inside, which is another Evanescence reference.
Christina Kann 16:38
They're all Evanescence references.
Haley Simpkiss 16:39
This has since been proven to have been written by a troll who was assuming the original author’s identity.
Zach of Cabbs 16:46
But honestly, if you don't know who Amy Lee is, like, get the fuck out of here.
Haley Simpkiss 16:50
Get da hell out of here.
Brooke Matherly 16:51
I once did a rendition of "My Immortal" at a Girl Scout talent show.
Zach of Cabbs 16:59
Oh my god.
Brooke Matherly 17:00
Here's the problem. We're not talking about a presentation for friends and family. We're talking about Alex, the other 12 people in our Girl Scout troop, and me just soulfully belting out a bad rendition of "My Immortal," after which my troop leader took me to the side and asked me if I was okay.
Haley Simpkiss 17:23
That song was a big one for me after the divorce, I gotta say.
Christina Kann 17:27
Okay, we all have trauma memories from Girl Scout camp.
Zach of Cabbs 17:32
Yeah, that one time I accidentally went to Girl Scout camp was really traumatic for me too. I was like, "I'm not supposed to be here!"
Christina Kann 17:38
I personally fell off the zipline at Girl Scout camp and realized I was fat, and I also got my first period at Girl Scout camp!
Brooke Matherly 17:48
This was a weekend sleepover in a clubhouse next to a pool.
Zach of Cabbs 17:53
My Immortal would totally make a great campfire sketch, though.
Christina Kann 17:59
Did any of y'all listen to Evanescence earnestly when they were cool?
Christina Kann 18:06
Yeah, my whole family was into Evanescence. My parents thought it was very dope.
Haley Simpkiss 18:10
It was very good for AMVs, I will say.
Zach of Cabbs 18:12
Peak aughts entertainment right there, Evanescence AMVs. Classic.
Christina Kann 18:17
What are you saying? AMVs?
Haley Simpkiss 18:18
Anime music videos. People would take animes and make music videos.
Zach of Cabbs 18:23
I used to do it on Windows Movie Maker. I remember those days.
Brooke Matherly 18:28
I thought I had a nerdy childhood, but every now and then I'm having a conversation with Haley, and I'm like, "Oh, no. There was a divide there."
Haley Simpkiss 18:43
Yeah there was! There was, Brooke!
Brooke Matherly 18:46
There's a degree of severity there.
Haley Simpkiss 18:49
You and me, we're not the same! We've matured, it's fine. Let's briefly discuss Tara Gillespie.
Zach of Cabbs 18:57
What we know so far.
Christina Kann 19:00
The accused author.
Zach of Cabbs 19:03
Order in the court!
Haley Simpkiss 19:05
First of all, this person had accounts and was active on them across multiple platforms at the time of writing. She had a Deviantart; I think she was on Gaia and shit. So this wasn't an isolated thing. If this was a troll, this was somebody who had really dedicated themselves to crafting this online identity.
Christina Kann 19:23
Honestly, drink every time we say "troll."
Zach of Cabbs 19:26
Are you adding all these things to the list as you're going?
Christina Kann 19:28
Yeah, right now we have to drink every time we say "Harry Potter," "pentagram," or "troll," or when there’s an outfit description.
Haley Simpkiss 19:38
She refers to Tom Riddle a couple times as Tom Bombadil.
Christina Kann 19:45
That was my favorite part, actually.
Zach of Cabbs 19:49
Is he hot?
Haley Simpkiss 19:53
Ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Apparently when they go back in time he is. His name is Tom Satan Bombadil. But also, this doesn't seem like a kid who would be aware of Tom Bombadil's existence, what with him only being in the Lord of the Rings books. So the plot thickens.
Brooke Matherly 20:11
There was crossover nerd culture in that time period between Lord of the Rings and everything else that was going on.
Haley Simpkiss 20:25
But it was mostly the films, especially for the shallow teenage girl audience.
Brooke Matherly 20:30
Right, but for the angsty goth kids it was knowing the books over the films, so I do think that's where a specific reference that was not in the films would tie in with this, quite frankly.
Zach of Cabbs 20:44
How much of the misinterpretation of the characters are completely rewritten versus just the person being ignorant of it? A lot of the Slytherin changes were obvious, but Hagrid being a student was weird.
Haley Simpkiss 21:02
There are author's notes through the whole thing. This was a big thing on fanfictions at this time.
Christina Kann 21:12
Reading those was like watching Secret Window, where the writer finds out that it was himself all along or whatever. Spoiler alerts for Secret Window!
Haley Simpkiss 21:18
The author's notes are the fucking B plot, because that's what gave us the lore! That's where all of the clues we have come from!
Christina Kann 21:26
What's going on with Raven???
Haley Simpkiss 21:27
Yeah, what is going on with Raven???
Zach of Cabbs 21:30
It’s like the annotations in Lord of the Rings. People are like, "You didn't read the annotations? You didn't read the books!"
Haley Simpkiss 21:35
In the author's notes a couple times, she's like, "I didn't read da book! Stop telling me Hagrid's not a student!" She's just decided he is now.
Brooke Matherly 21:44
She makes a specific reference to finding the way that he interacts with them creepy, and she says she's making Hagrid a student to showcase how weird his interactions with these students are, which quite frankly, Tara, I stand behind.
Zach of Cabbs 22:00
All right, Tara. Tara, surprising little pocket of wokeness there.
Haley Simpkiss 22:06
And Dumbledore only called them "motherfukers" because he had a headache. I'm going to bring that up every time his character appears. She mentions being from somewhere called Dubya in the very last chapter. Theories as to what this might be include Dubai, Dublin, or just a state or town starting with the letter W.
Zach of Cabbs 22:31
She's from Western Texas or something.
Haley Simpkiss 22:34
I want to say Wisconsin; I feel in my soul that it's gotta be Wisconsin.
Brooke Matherly 22:39
Maybe it's just our general proximity, but I saw Dubya and thought Washington DC.
Haley Simpkiss 22:47
She claimed to have gone on vacation to Transylvania and seen the castle where Dracula was filmed. The castle where Dracula was filmed is in California, I believe. There's a castle in Transylvania that supposedly inspired Bram Stoker, but also, did she actually go to Transylvania? Who's to say?
Zach of Cabbs 23:05
Putting Transylvania in your author's note was the 2008 equivalent of photoshopping a vacation photo on Instagram.
Haley Simpkiss 23:13
One of the biggest mysteries is her co-author/beta reader, nicknamed Raven aka bloodytearz666. She is the character Willow in the series. She peaced out around Chapter 15 after Tara and Raven had a falling out over a sweater. The character of Willow was subsequently expelled and murdered, and her corpse was violated by "Loopin"—again, all of the characters are pedophiles, and apparently in this case, also necrophiliacs—and was later brought back with zero explanation. So I’m not sure what happened there. But that's around the point where the text becomes 100% unreadable, which is why I have trouble getting past Chapter 16. There's nothing even resembling a sense of coherency after there.
Haley Simpkiss 23:43
So that's what we know. I'm going to try real fast to get through the people who, over the years, have either been theorized to be Tara or have claimed to be Tara. The first are the Acid Bath Sisters. In 2009, a YouTube channel featuring two teenage mall goths called Tara and Raven blew up because it featured two cringey teenage girls singing along to MCR and talking about how much they hated preps.
Christina Kann 24:49
This is what I told you I was watching. I told Haley I was in too deep, and she literally was like, "Honestly bitch, you have no idea what ‘in too deep’ is."
Zach of Cabbs 24:57
There is an iceberg here. There's a My Immortal iceberg here.
Haley Simpkiss 25:03
Oh, we're diving deep, guys.
Zach of Cabbs 25:06
Here we go.
Christina Kann 25:07
These videos were, yes, very, very, can confirm, very cringey singalongs. A good time.
Haley Simpkiss 25:16
For years, people just assumed. "Well, it's gotta be them! It's Tara and Raven! They talk about preps all the time. They're goths! I still can't tell if it's a joke, but there's no way it's not them." But they never mentioned the fic. They never really talked about Harry Potter at all. That seemed kind of weird to people. Around 2014, Tara resurfaced on the internet. People recognize her, and subsequently she is interviewed and reveals that Raven in those videos was her sister. Their real names were Sarah and Rachel. They had been cringey mall goths in middle school. At the point where they were making the videos, they'd stopped being that way. So the videos were them making fun of their younger selves.
Brooke Matherly 26:09
Yeah, there are no middle-aged to elderly mall goths. That's a thing everybody grows out of. You're not allowed to grow old as a mall goth.
Christina Kann 26:20
I feel like you have to move from the mall to Costco or something, and it's not as good anymore.
Brooke Matherly 26:24
You have to find a place that still has a mall, and that mall has to have a Hot Topic. It's a high bar to clear.
Zach of Cabbs 26:31
Hi, folks, from the future. Malls don't really exist anymore. That's something that was never expected in 2005, huh?
Haley Simpkiss 26:40
It was 2009 when they were making these videos, so they would have still been in high school. In 2014, people recognized her and said, "Holy shit. It's that girl. Were you the My Immortal bitch?" And she was like, "No, we honestly didn't even know that My Immortal existed when we made those videos." So that was debunked.
Haley Simpkiss 26:59
This is the big one, the Rose Christo debacle. Rose Christo "confessed" to authorship quietly on Tumblr in early 2017, but she didn't have that much of a following. It didn't really gain any traction; no one noticed.
A couple months later, a book called The Handbook for Mortals, a self-published YA novel, somehow hits the New York Times bestseller list—which is weird, because no one seems to have read it. So this becomes a huge mystery. A couple people actually buy it to see what's going on, and the book is so flagrantly terrible that readers started speculating that maybe this was the author of My Immortal. The author of this book, Lani Sarem, might be Tara.
Brooke Matherly 27:43
Publisher nerd note: Who published that book?
Haley Simpkiss 27:46
She self-published it, and it made it onto the New York Times bestseller list. As it turned out, she was calling around to bookstores who report their sales to the Times and buying huge bulk orders of her own book from them. That's a thing you can do. It's gaming the system.
Christina Kann 28:05
Oh, that's brilliant!
Zach of Cabbs 28:08
You all are in books; I'm in games. A few years ago, Steam opened up its restrictions. You no longer have to get your game greenlit by the community; anybody can just publish on Steam. You just put in the paperwork and pay the money, and boom, you're on Steam. So there are hundreds, if not thousands, of garbage games released on the platform literally every day, and it's impossible to find anything decent. Is it like that at all in the book industry?
Haley Simpkiss 28:35
Well, self-publishing. Yeah.
Christina Kann 28:38
There are a lot of bad books, but I don't think it's ever hard to find the good ones.
Brooke Matherly 28:43
I think that's only true if you're just casting randomly through Amazon. If you type "books" into the Amazon search bar, you may end up in that scenario.
Zach of Cabbs 28:53
Don't sort books by New > All? Is that what you're saying?
Christina Kann 28:56
I'm going to take this opportunity to plug Storygraph again. I find out what books are good by turning to my peers and seeing what they have said.
Zach of Cabbs 29:10
*Zach’s power cuts off*
Christina Kann 29:11
Oh my god.
Zach of Cabbs 29:12
I lost power.
Haley Simpkiss 29:13
Christina Kann 29:16
That's very dramatic.
Zach of Cabbs 29:18
It's not coming back!
Christina Kann 29:19
We might lose you. That would be very goffick.
*Zach’s power comes back*
Zach of Cabbs 29:22
Okay, it's back. It's back for now. It should be okay.
Christina Kann 29:28
Brooke Matherly 29:30
Zach of Cabbs 29:31
I was about to light a candle and say, "Play me off like I'm on the Titanic!" But please continue. I'm riveted.
Haley Simpkiss 29:39
People start thinking Lani Sarem might be Tara Gillespie.
Christina Kann 29:43
Haley Simpkiss 29:44
Lani Sarem is the person who wrote Handbook for Mortals, which made it onto the New York Times Bestseller list. It was so bad that people thought maybe this is Tara Gillespie.
At this point, Rose Christo, who is also a self-published YA author, comes forward and says, "No, it's not her. It's me!" Also, she announces in this refutation that her tell-all memoir is being published by Macmillan. She has provided evidence to them; she has a flash drive with the first 11 unedited chapters.
Brooke Matherly 30:20
Wait, wait, wait, that was a bombshell. There was editing done to this?
Haley Simpkiss 30:24
Yeah, that's what Raven was doing!
Zach of Cabbs 30:28
That's why the first 15 chapters are at all legible.
Christina Kann 30:31
That's the thing! There wasn't just one of these people. There were two of them making this happen.
Zach of Cabbs 30:38
This is like My Favorite Murder but for fanfiction.
Haley Simpkiss 30:42
That's what it feels like! The reason Rose Christo is writing this memoir about writing My Immortal is because she claims that she is a Native American Cree childhood sexual abuse survivor, who wrote My Immortal as part of an effort to find the younger brother who she’d lost in the foster care system. How, you might ask?
Christina Kann 31:09
Brooke Matherly 31:10
Wait wait wait. She wrote My Immortal to find the brother, or she wrote her memoir to find him?
Haley Simpkiss 31:16
She wrote My Immortal looking for her brother.
Zach of Cabbs 31:19
There's that one part in Chapter 5 where she goes, "Hey, I have a brother. His name is Andrew. I really want to find him. Please dial this number if you've seen him!" I remember it like it was yesterday. It was only part of the book that made any sense.
Haley Simpkiss 31:31
You guys didn't catch that one line?
Zach of Cabbs 31:35
You gotta read between the lines. Subtext.
Haley Simpkiss 31:38
A couple of weeks later, someone contacts a Kiwi Farms forum that is dedicated to debunking stuff—admittedly, it's a pretty shady forum—claiming to be said brother. He apparently provided proof to the mods sufficient for them to believe that he was the brother. He claimed that not only had he and his sister never been in the foster care system, but they were white as hell.
Christina Kann 32:03
That's not surprising.
Haley Simpkiss 32:05
Yeah, because everything about that story sounded like it was specially crafted to gain as much unquestioning support from the user base of Tumblr in 2017 as humanly possible. She loses the book deal, obviously. Here's the thing, though: The brother did say that, as a teenager, she liked making fun of bad fanfiction, and she also liked to go by Tara. So she might have honestly been the author.
Zach of Cabbs 32:38
Brooke Matherly 32:38
But in that scenario, we would be assuming that she was doing this as a joke.
Haley Simpkiss 32:43
Brooke Matherly 32:44
This would be a troll scenario. I said "troll"; you all drink.
Christina Kann 32:48
Oh, Brooke, no.
Brooke Matherly 32:51
I don't drink alcohol, for the listeners at home. So...
Christina Kann 32:54
I told her to have water ready.
Haley Simpkiss 32:56
Christina Kann 32:56
You're gonna be so hydrated, bitch.
Zach of Cabbs 32:58
You're gonna be like, "Tina I need a break! I need to pee!"
Haley Simpkiss 33:00
I am going to need a new drink soon. While the court documents she provided to Macmillan to prove the whole foster care story were proven indeed to be photoshopped, nothing could really be proven one way or the other about the flash drive. It was clearly a flash drive from 2006, but was the file on there legitimate? Who's to say? I actually looked on Rose Christo's Amazon page as part of the deep dive I did on this, and her bio has been updated, basically saying, "Hey, so a lot of people over the last few years have been asking me ‘What happened?’ And ‘Are you okay?’ And I'm just popping in here to say a couple years ago, I was diagnosed with schizoaffective disorder, which probably comes as no surprise to the people in my life, but now that I'm medicated, yeah, that makes sense. So I'm sorry about everything. And I am going to be keeping out of the public eye from now on." Here's the thing though: she doesn't confirm one way or the other whether she wrote it!!!
Brooke Matherly 34:05
Wait, wait, wait, hold on. If she was faking this, and she had 11 unedited chapters on a thumb drive, we are to assume that in pursuit of an elaborate ruse, she took the first 11 chapters of My Immortal, went in, and made it intentionally shittier?
Zach of Cabbs 34:27
Added passages about her clothing choices into the novel. "In addition to this, I was also wearing..."
Brooke Matherly 34:38
That was an outfit description, and you guys have to drink.
Zach of Cabbs 34:40
Oh, shit. Yeah, you're right, fuck!
Christina Kann 34:41
Thank you so much, Brooke. Love you, babe. I really appreciate it.
Brooke Matherly 34:44
I'm here for you.
Zach of Cabbs 34:46
I think you're onto something there, because that feels like an Occam's razor situation. It has to be the simpler thing. It doesn't even feel like she was a Harry Potter fan. She just watched Harry Potter and thought Daniel Radcliffe and Malfoy were hot, and she was like, "I'm gonna write a fanfic where I get to date both of them!"
Brooke Matherly 35:10
Here's how I know she was young: at no point was she like, "The obvious answer to this scenario is a threesome." She's like, "I guess I have to do both of them at the same time?"
Zach of Cabbs 35:21
"Well, they have to fight over me!"
Haley Simpkiss 35:23
Also everyone except her is bi, but also she's super homophobic. I am going to get another drink because the last one is an honorable mention, but it is weird.
Zach of Cabbs 35:34
The character says she's bi, anyway, at multiple points.
Brooke Matherly 35:40
I kept going, thinking, "Surely this ends in a threesome." They got so close with the sex tape scenario, and then it just didn't happen. You can take two dicks at once. It's nice. I highly recommend it.
Zach of Cabbs 35:55
It feels like the culmination of all of this would be that. You write the first 30 chapters so you can write the double dickin' scene, and that never happens. It's anticlimactic.
Christina Kann 36:08
Haley, what are you drinking?
Haley Simpkiss 36:09
What do you think?
Christina Kann 36:11
Zach of Cabbs 36:14
I'm just drinking margarita mix and a lot of tequila.
Christina Kann 36:18
That's called a margarita, my man.
Zach of Cabbs 36:19
It is called a margarita, but it's in a very unsexy non-margarita mug.
Christina Kann 36:24
I'm drinking Winking Owl brand chardonnay. That's $2.74, I think, per bottle.
Zach of Cabbs 36:32
The size of the mug that this is in makes it look like I have a problem.
Brooke Matherly 36:37
You look like an alcoholic teacher right now.
Zach of Cabbs 36:41
Shut up! I got these papers to grade! I ain't got time for this shit.
Brooke Matherly 36:45
You look like you showed up to your class, kicked your feet up on the desk, and were like, "Look, kids, American history is bullshit."
Zach of Cabbs 36:52
I was like Jack Black in School of Rock, just like, "Oh god, who's got food?"
Haley Simpkiss 37:01
All right, last one.
Christina Kann 37:03
Where are we?
Haley Simpkiss 37:03
We are on our honorable mention.
Zach of Cabbs 37:07
The season three finale of the anime! Pay attention.
Haley Simpkiss 37:12
One of the resources I looked to during this was a YouTuber called Sarah Z, who a little over a year ago made a video talking about the whole Rose Christo thing and also the Acid Bath Sisters and the whole mystery.
Zach of Cabbs 37:26
Big shout out to Sarah Z. She has several videos on Homestuck that are incredibly cool.
Haley Simpkiss 37:35
I have never gotten into Homestuck, and I am scared.
Zach of Cabbs 37:44
Neither have I, but the people who tried to make the Homestuck game threatened her with legal action because of the journalism she did on the game. It's a crazy story. Anyway, check out Sarah Z. She's great.
Haley Simpkiss 37:52
Apparently this happens to her a lot, because not long after she posted that video, someone contacted her claiming to be the author and calling himself Todd Gillespie. He had some answers to some of her questions, but he consistently ducked a lot of timeline and account access questions. Sarah Z started looking deeper and got involved with another YouTuber, Red Bard. They got together and did some In True Blood shit. I won't get into the full details, but you guys can watch here if you have two free hours. Their digging revealed a whole mess involving Bible fanfiction—which is a thing—as well as over 20 sock puppet identities Todd had used to troll himself over the last couple of decades, plus a recurring character named Gareth Vandersweld.
Zach of Cabbs 37:56
Anybody who spends that much time fucking with people on the internet is trolling themselves. Let's be honest.
Haley Simpkiss 39:07
Every fandom community that he's in is like 90% just him.
Brooke Matherly 39:13
The thing that keeps coming up with all of these supposed authors is that mental illness has always existed, and one of the dark things about the internet is that it's become a form of entertainment, where we follow these people who are obviously not doing well, and they can garner attention and some sort of satisfaction by giving in completely to whatever it is that is ailing them instead of taking active steps to better their lives.
Christina Kann 39:47
Haley Simpkiss 39:48
Yeah, you're absolutely right. That's kind of how that video ends, after she found out this was all the same dude. It's Todd all the way down.
Zach of Cabbs 39:59
Well, that's it for the podcast, everybody. We'll see you next time.
Brooke Matherly 40:03
Thank you for joining us for this very special episode.
Haley Simpkiss 40:06
He is definitely not the author, but he is probably the person who hacked the account in 2008 after it was deleted, and he might have even been the person to delete it. They found him; they did not give his information away, but they did find him. In real life, he is apparently a 28-year-old musician from New Zealand. A lot of people have claimed to be the author over the years; he's at least two of them.
Brooke Matherly 40:33
Whoa, wait, who was the second one?
Zach of Cabbs 40:36
Too late. We're moving on!
Haley Simpkiss 40:37
He claimed it in 2008 around the time of the account hacking, and I think he did it again in 2011, but nobody paid attention. Now people have started talking about My Immortal again, particularly Sarah Z and her video. It sounds like he's trying to hop on that bandwagon. So yeah, that's Todd.
Christina Kann 40:55
I see. That's so much lore, honestly.
Haley Simpkiss 40:59
Yeah, there's a lot!
Zach of Cabbs 41:00
Yeah, it's a dump. Like Haley was saying, the Sarah Z videos, which I highly recommend, are extremely informative. Even if you've never heard of this fanfic, by the end, you will be sitting there riveted, saying, "I need to know!"
Haley Simpkiss 41:14
Yep. That's an overview of the lore as short and sweet as I could possibly make it.
Christina Kann 41:21
And well done.
Haley Simpkiss 41:21
Thank you. I'm really sorry, guys. But now you know.
Christina Kann 41:24
Thank you for taking us on this ride.
Haley Simpkiss 41:27
You're very welcome. So let's talk the story. Insofar as there's a story.
Zach of Cabbs 41:33
There's a story? I'm sorry. You said a story?
Haley Simpkiss 41:36
Let's talk the string of events.
Zach of Cabbs 41:40
I want to start by saying that I have gotten a lot of unironic enjoyment out of this fanfic over the years. In college, I would gather a crowd of 8 to 10 people in the common room of my Hogwarts house, as it were, the common areas of the campus, just gathering a crowd doing a dramatic reading of My Immortal off my laptop. Very fun memories that I have from this truly awful, awful, awful fanfiction.
Christina Kann 42:08
Haley, you first presented this to me with a similar little story about reading it with Willow and Emma, right?
Haley Simpkiss 42:16
Yes, I think it was Willow who told me about it because she used to lovingly make fun of me for reading fanfiction.
Christina Kann 42:25
But this one has a character named Willow, so she had to check it out.
Brooke Matherly 42:28
Important distinction for the listeners: We're talking about Haley's sister, not the infamous character who gets written off unceremoniously.
Zach of Cabbs 42:37
I'm here to announce my new secret sleeper podcast, The Rejected Section, where we read one chapter of My Immortal each week until it is over.
Brooke Matherly 42:49
And then you start again, because it's fucking immortal.
Zach of Cabbs 42:53
That should be the title of the episode, The Rejected Section.
Brooke Matherly 42:58
No, seriously, what if you did that? You just kept doing it over and every time you got to the end, you just started back at the beginning and kept doing it until you went insane.
Haley Simpkiss 43:06
Brooke, that sounds exactly as pathological as Todd!
Zach of Cabbs 43:13
There's a podcast called The Worst Idea of All Time where they watched Grown Ups 2 over and over again every week for a year, and they slowly descend into madness because it's such a nothing movie.
Haley Simpkiss 43:32
To what end?
Brooke Matherly 43:33
Haley, Haley, Haley, Haley, excuse you. You just read roughly 45 minutes of My Immortal lore off notecards. You don't get to make that concerned face at the fact that someone made a decent podcast.
Christina Kann 43:45
Here's how I took notes for this episode: I put the text into a Google Doc and just started highlighting stuff. So I'm just gonna start scrolling on through. I highlighted some stuff that we've mentioned already. We've mentioned a lot of things.
Zach of Cabbs 43:58
The way I took notes was I had the fic open in a separate window, and I was listening to the Internet Historian do a dramatic reading of it.
Brooke Matherly 44:06
I did the same thing!
Zach of Cabbs 44:08
Every time he made me laugh, I would pause it and go to that section and copy and paste it into a notepad.
Brooke Matherly 44:14
I listened to the Internet Historian's dramatic reading of this "work" as well. It's worth a watch. I would say it's the preferred way to experience this. I couldn't make it far reading it. My brain wouldn't relax enough to just take the words in. When you're reading, you're not reading every word. You look at words, and your brain's like, "We got it." Although I have heard that’s not the way everybody reads. Sorry. That's like a fun psychology thing.
Christina Kann 44:56
We have been known to be a little elitist about reading here.
Brooke Matherly 45:01
No, there are two ways people process the concept of reading. Some people actually take in every single word, and then some people can visually scan a sentence and their brain just kind of downloads the information. I've read a couple of psychological studies about this. The way you read determines a lot about the way you speak and the way you take in information. It's not even an elitist thing. My husband, for example, is also a very avid reader, but he reads every single word when he's reading.
Zach of Cabbs 45:38
But y'all are in publication. So this is almost like Icarus flying too close to the sun for you. It's like, "I can't look directly at it, or I will hurt my eyes."
Brooke Matherly 45:50
I tried reading it, and my brain just couldn't get to the point where I stopped seeing every individual word. And when I was looking at every individual word, it made even less sense. It wasn't even coming together at all. I was just like, "Da—cuz—fangs. What is—fucking—black. Black, black, black, black."
Haley Simpkiss 46:13
The idea of a codified language where every word is spelled the same every single time you write it is kind of a new concept. If you read old medieval manuscripts, people just wrote shit out phonetically. Most people didn't read in their heads; most people read out loud, if they were going to read, or at least moved their lips. So you were following along anyway like this.
Brooke Matherly 46:41
But this is not phonetic. This does follow a codified language that existed on the internet in certain communities in the early 2000s.
Zach of Cabbs 46:50
Are you saying Tara was raised by wolves or something?
Brooke Matherly 46:55
I think Tara was born in the storeroom of a Hot Topic and then crawled out fully formed in a corset.
Haley Simpkiss 47:03
I think that Tara, whoever she was, was born into a relatively Christian, normie-ass household and really resented it. She wanted to be a cool, sexy goth and rebel against everything her family was doing, but she had no resources for it. So she was just like, "I'm just going to put everything that I think is cool in here. This is what goths do."
Brooke Matherly 47:31
The thing that really hits me about this entire thing is the outfit descriptions, which we've already touched on. I really want to break this down for a second. Haley, could you just do a brief reading of just an outfit? I know we kind of did at the beginning. But does anyone have one bookmarked?
Christina Kann 47:39
Zach of Cabbs 47:51
After the fifth or sixth one, the Internet Historian just fast forwards through them. It's really funny.
Haley Simpkiss 47:55
I've got one from chapter two.
I got out of my coffin and took of my giant MCR t-shirt which I used for pajamas. Instead, I put on a black leather dress, a pentagram necklace, combat boots and black fishnets on. I put on four pairs of earrings in my pierced ears, and put my hair in a kind of messy bun.
Brooke Matherly 48:18
When I was first writing as a child, I was not into goth culture, but this is exactly what my descriptions of characters read like 100% of the time. The most important thing the reader needs to know is exactly what this dress looks like.
Zach of Cabbs 48:36
If they don't know, how will they picture my character? They'll have no clothes on! That's awkward.
Haley Simpkiss 48:40
That is something that's important to examine about My Immortal. Why is this considered the worst fanfiction ever? Obviously, that's hyperbole, but I've read a lot of pretty bad fanfiction, and the thing that makes this one stand out is that it's textbook. Every single thing that could ever make a fanfiction bad is in this.
Zach of Cabbs 49:03
Literally all the awful tropes are here.
Haley Simpkiss 49:05
For example, the fact that it has basically nothing to do with the original story and none of the characters have any resemblance to their actual characters.
Zach of Cabbs 49:15
I think deeper than that, it shows a profound disrespect for the source material. It simply does not care about the source material. It doesn't value it; it doesn't find any enjoyment in it. It needs to rearrange all of it to make it palatable to the author. That's the bad taste it puts in everyone's mouth.
Brooke Matherly 49:35
There’s also the outfit descriptions, especially the fact that every single person is wearing a band t-shirt almost always.
Christina Kann 49:43
It's one of my favorite things about this.
Zach of Cabbs 49:44
I love going to those Hogsmeade MCR concerts, hell yeah!
Brooke Matherly 49:48
This immediately flashed me back to when my very first girlfriend wanted a Cradle of Filth t-shirt for her birthday. This was my first significant other, and I was very, very hell-bent on getting this right. I got to Hot Topic—because of course—and there were three Cradle of Filth t-shirts. I had literally never listened to Cradle of Filth in my life. I didn't know metal music at all. This Hot Topic employee was asking me questions about my girlfriend, and I was trying to explain what was going on so I could select the correct one. In the end, I got the wrong album cover, and she let me know that. She still wore the t-shirt; she still thought it was really cool to have; whatever, she was still excited.
Zach of Cabbs 50:45
I 100% would have just gotten the one I thought looked the coolest.
Brooke Matherly 50:49
They all looked like garbage to me. They all looked like a baby puke with red lettering.
Zach of Cabbs 50:54
Oh, I can picture it. My mind went right to what you're talking about.
Haley Simpkiss 50:58
But also, Hot Topic employees do be that way. They will try to help you.
Brooke Matherly 51:04
They'll absolutely try to help you. The person who was talking to me was literally just like, "Okay, what albums does she have in the car? What do the covers look like? Does any of this imagery look familiar to you?" And I was looking at the Hot Topic wall of band t-shirts, and I was just like, "Everything's blank. Everything's blank."
Haley Simpkiss 51:23
"All of them look like barbed wire fences. I don't know!"
Zach of Cabbs 51:26
Every time I walked into a Hot Topic as a kid, I was like, "Am I gonna buy a t-shirt or are we gonna play laser tag? This is such a weird atmosphere. I don't understand it."
Haley Simpkiss 51:35
I miss old-school Hot Topic.
Brooke Matherly 51:37
I went in for—and this is another thing that got brought up in this fanfic—hair spray paint. You could temporarily change the color of your hair, and purple hair spray paint featured prominently in my young adult life. Now I'm old enough that I go pay $300 to get someone to permanently dye my hair purple, and that's the kind of character progression I've been on.
Zach of Cabbs 51:57
That's what they call an arc.
Christina Kann 52:04
I'm looking through my highlighted selections. I highlighted the first time the text casually mentioned, "And then I went and slit my wrists." I was like, "Woo, red alert!" but then you quickly get desensitized.
Brooke Matherly 52:16
There's a point where the author says, "I went to slit my wrist and party with Draco and Vampire in the common room." I thought, "Oh, wow, those things are not connected."
Christina Kann 52:31
Well, it's like the most goffick thing that you're a vampire, so you slit your wrists, and it doesn't even really do anything.
Brooke Matherly 52:41
There's a point where she does it and then she takes a straw and drinks from her own wrist.
Zach of Cabbs 52:46
Get it? Because vampires drink blood? That should be the way canonically a vampire turns into a zombie, by drinking their own blood.
Brooke Matherly 52:56
I like that and also I'm mad that this didn't feature at all in The Twilight Saga.
Haley Simpkiss 53:01
Apparently Tara, toward the end, was getting into Twilight.
Brooke Matherly 53:05
You can tell!
Haley Simpkiss 53:07
There's a similarly bad Twilight fanfiction out there that people think she might also have written.
Christina Kann 53:17
I seent it.
Haley Simpkiss 53:18
The three lines that my sisters and I still quote at each other to this day are:
Christina Kann 53:45
I can't stop laughing.
Zach of Cabbs 53:47
I would love to read three short paragraphs that I think encapsulate why so many people hate this fanfic so much. I think it is the perfect passage.
Haley Simpkiss 53:59
Go for it.
Zach of Cabbs 54:00
“Its so unfair!” I yielded. “Why can’t I just be ugly or plain like all da other girls and preps here except for B’loody Mary, because she’s not ugly or anything.”
“Why would you wanna be ugly? I don’t like the preps anyway. They are such fucking sluts.” answered Draco.
“Yeah but everyone is in love with me! Like Snape and Loopin took a video of me naked. Hargrid says he’s in love with me. Vampire likes me and now even Snaketail is in love with me! I just wanna be with you ok Draco! Why couldn’t Satan have made me less beautiful?” I shouted angrily. (an” don’t wory enoby isn’t a snob or anyfing but a lot of ppl hav told her shes pretty) “Im good at too many things! WHY CAN’T I JUST BE NORMAL? IT’S A FUCKING CURSE!” I shouted and then I ran away.
Christina Kann 54:54
Brooke Matherly 54:55
To me, that's an early Twilight bleed, quite frankly.
Christina Kann 54:59
Yes. You did highlight one thing I noted consistently throughout this. The dialogue tags are really, really, really hilarious.
Brooke Matherly 55:11
They read like someone who speaks English as a second language.
Christina Kann 55:15
And who has been told that stylistically you shouldn't use the word "said." Here's my next comment. They make a lot of fun of Hilary Duff in this. First of all, the book I'm reading right now was written by Hilary Duff, or at least conceptualized by Hilary Duff. Also, when I was 12 or 13 years old, my dad bought me Hilary Duff concert tickets for my birthday. It was right when I was just a little too edgy for that, Dad. But he got them for me, and he was really proud. So I took my friend Laney, who was even more goffick than me—I'm not even being funny, she really was. At the concert, Hilary Duff was wearing the same fishnet gloves that Laney was wearing, and Laney was like, "Fuck this!" and threw them down on the floor and stomped away.
Brooke Matherly 56:08
Guys, being a teenager is awful.
Haley Simpkiss 56:10
It really is. Zach read that whole thing, and that's the kind of line where you could very well hear that and think, "Okay, this is someone being ridiculous on purpose." But then you remember what being 13 was like, especially if you have the experience of being a 13-year-old girl. And it's not unbelievable.
Brooke Matherly 56:34
Especially being a 13-year-old girl during this phase in the culture. I dabbled on the edges of this entire aesthetic. I never went full in.
Zach of Cabbs 56:46
I was deep in the paint.
Brooke Matherly 56:49
Hold on. Did you do the just-back-of-the-head spiky? You know what I mean? Like the halo spike?
Haley Simpkiss 56:55
The Sasuke hair?
Christina Kann 56:56
That would look good on you, Zach!
Zach of Cabbs 56:57
Who, me? No. No, I was deep in the paint of nerdom, not gothicism.
Brooke Matherly 57:04
I was on the edge, the raw corners, of the mall goth aesthetic. I went to a lot of punk rock shows. I did a lot of mosh pits in my day. I went to Warped Tour.
Christina Kann 57:26
That is so cool.
Zach of Cabbs 57:28
I definitely was a post-hardcore brat, but I never really adopted the aesthetic myself. I was always a t-shirt and jeans guy.
Haley Simpkiss 57:37
I was always meant to be a t-shirt and jeans kind of person, but I did have a little bit of an emo phase in middle school/high school. My friends were all cooler and better at it and had parents who actually would buy them clothes from Hot Topic. It wasn't that my parents said, "Absolutely not. No, never." It was just expensive, and they didn't like going to the mall.
Brooke Matherly 58:04
I blame Hot Topic and this general time period for two things: Adult Twilight fans. The people who were adults at the time Twilight came out and were getting full back tattoos of Edward's eyes. Hot Topic went super hard on Twilight stuff when it first came out. And the other thing I blame it for is adult women who are way too into the Nightmare Before Christmas.
Christina Kann 58:30
Yeah. I'm with you on that one.
Brooke Matherly 58:33
There are a few things in this world that I consider to be true warning flag tattoos outside of your basic confederate flag bullshit. A full sleeve of Nightmare Before Christmas tells me exactly who you have been, who you are now, and where you are going.
Christina Kann 58:51
I feel like that's not even the first time you've brought this up on the show.
Brooke Matherly 58:54
It might not be. It's a deeply held belief of mine.
Haley Simpkiss 58:57
It is one of Enoby's favorite movies, right up there with Corpse Bride.
Brooke Matherly 59:03
Of course! Like, of course. Regarding the question of is it parody or is it real? Every last bit of this is stuff that makes you think, "Of course it's there. It makes sense that it's there. It makes sense that her favorite movie is Corpse Bride." That was 100% right for the time period. The My Chemical Romance t-shirts; even the fact that you would go and specifically get a really big one to sleep in. It was 100% a thing. All of this stuff is so perfectly fitted together with the actual way that it was that it either has to be a masterful troll--drink—or it has to be someone who was honestly doing this. I fall back every time on someone who was honestly doing this because I knew people who would have done this.
Zach of Cabbs 59:58
This is either someone who was briefly into this for a few years and did it in earnest, or an elaborate troll who has spent literally every day of the past decade fooling everyone into thinking that My Immortal is real.
Brooke Matherly 1:00:12
And I don't think it's worth that. You know what I mean? It would be different if there was any money involved, if there was any actual fame involved. If there was any way to spin it, I think someone would have spun it by now. Because if you can do this, there's a writing job on television for you somewhere. But I don't think that's what happened. I think this is genuine, and it was a very short-lived period in someone's life.
Christina Kann 1:00:38
I want to talk briefly about the way that sex is described in this.
Haley Simpkiss 1:00:43
Christina Kann 1:00:45
I have a selection highlighted.
Zach of Cabbs 1:00:46
Please read it.
Christina Kann 1:00:46
Then he put his thingie into my you-know-what and we did it for the first time.
And I think that's her losing her virginity.
Haley Simpkiss 1:00:47
Yeah. That's right before WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU DOING YOU MOTHERFUKERS!
Christina Kann 1:00:54
Yeah, two lines in front of it. But that part, to me, makes it feel more authentic. I think that it was someone who was simply too young to be writing about sex but still was glorifying sex
Zach of Cabbs 1:01:13
A little bonus is that she forgot the second F so it sounds almost biblical.
He took of my clothes, and I took of my bra.
Brooke Matherly 1:01:26
Zach, since we were watching the same rendition of this, did you happen to highlight the part in the Internet Historian video of this where it's maybe the third time they have sex, when they're in Draco's car, and they're talking about his tool, and the Internet Historian does probably one of the funniest things that he does in this entire video. He has a drill going into a toolbox, and it just starts vibrating aggressively as the drill turns on.
Zach of Cabbs 1:01:56
I was listening to it while I was working, so I don't think I caught a lot of the visuals.
Brooke Matherly 1:02:00
Same. The imagery that the text is using is something around like tools and then like spinning around. That was a particularly strong sex image to me that sounded like someone who had been told by—back to Haley's point—incredibly conservative Christian parents what sex is, so that that base is covered, and you can tell them never to do it. You know what I mean? "He's gonna take his 'tool' and you have a 'toolbox.'"
Zach of Cabbs 1:02:42
"Listen, dicks??? They spin at 60 RPMs and they will tear you up! Don't do it!"
Brooke Matherly 1:02:50
The language of "his thing in my you-know-what" is like exactly like an awkward Christian mom trying to explain just enough about sex so that you know what it is enough to not do it.
Zach of Cabbs 1:03:02
"He put his hoo-ha and my heehee."
Christina Kann 1:03:05
Yes, the sex talk seemed very immature to me.
Brooke Matherly 1:03:08
Wait, one more note: my grandma the entire time we were growing up referred to them as "woozies" and "doozies."
Haley Simpkiss 1:03:14
Which was the woozy and which was the doozy?
Brooke Matherly 1:03:16
You know which one was the woozy and which one was the doozy. Think about it for a second.
Christina Kann 1:03:19
"Woo" for woman.
Zach of Cabbs 1:03:19
And "doozy" for "dick"!
Christina Kann 1:03:25
I can't emphasize this enough: teach children what body parts are called.
Haley Simpkiss 1:03:29
Zach of Cabbs 1:03:30
BDE: big doozy energy.
Haley Simpkiss 1:03:36
That's gonna be a t-shirt. We need to make that a t-shirt.
Christina Kann 1:03:40
Another thing I noticed throughout was the very funny disses that get thrown around.
Zach of Cabbs 1:03:47
They're also good.
Christina Kann 1:03:48
Right in front of me I have highlighted "you ludicrous fools" and "you mediocre dunces!"
Zach of Cabbs 1:03:53
I love "you mediocre dunces."
Brooke Matherly 1:03:55
Dunderhead? Dunderhead comes up a lot.
Zach of Cabbs 1:03:59
I'm surprised there wasn't some religion born out of "Let's decipher this fanfic and find out what the secret message is being told here."
Christina Kann 1:04:06
Is that not what we're doing right now?
Brooke Matherly 1:04:08
What if Tara was a prophet and this is the latest iteration of the Bible?
Haley Simpkiss 1:04:12
Christina Kann 1:04:15
Oh man. "We started frenching passively." I think it means passionately.
Brooke Matherly 1:04:22
I like the passively.
Zach of Cabbs 1:04:25
Between this and the other author whose works are discussed on this podcast, this author is still the less hateable one.
Christina Kann 1:04:36
An interesting and earnest backstory. I also like this one: "We started to make out keenly." I feel like more makeouts should be super keen, you know?
Zach of Cabbs 1:04:44
Oh, super keen. I was keen on that makeout, okay?
Brooke Matherly 1:04:48
Also, on an intimate level, I connect to the idea of just having sex passively on occasion. Just like, "Hey, look like we're gonna make out. It's gonna be real passive."
Christina Kann 1:04:59
We've all been there.
Haley Simpkiss 1:05:01
We're both on our phones.
Brooke Matherly 1:05:07
We've both realized that it's been too long and we're gonna do this, but we're aware that this is putting in some maintenance. This is an oil change in the relationship.
Zach of Cabbs 1:05:18
He had a sexy English accent. He looked exactly like Joel Madden. He was so sexy that my body went all hot when I saw him kind of like an erection only I’m a girl so I didn’t get one you sicko.
Christina Kann 1:05:29
Oh my god. I highlighted that because I think it was her first glaringly homophobic statement. I was like "Red alert!"
Haley Simpkiss 1:05:35
Can we discuss the dialogue tags on the following exchange?
“I’m so sorry.” he said in a shy voice.
“That’s all right. What’s your name?” I questioned.
“My name’s Harry Potter, although most people call me Vampire these days.” he grumbled.
“Why?” I exclaimed.
“Because I love the taste of human blood.” he giggled.
“Well, I am a vampire.” I confessed.
“Really?” he whimpered.
“Yeah.” I roared.
Christina Kann 1:06:05
"Whimpered" and "roared." Those are both such strong words that seem wildly inappropriate for the situation, both equally in different directions.
Brooke Matherly 1:06:15
Can we talk about the fact that Harry's pentagram isn't a real pentagram? He at one point admits to having just makeup'd over it, and then the scar comes shining back through.
Zach of Cabbs 1:06:30
Who changed the star for him?
Brooke Matherly 1:06:32
Whatever Ron's analogous character is. It's a real left-field word. I forget what it is.
Christina Kann 1:06:41
I LOLed when it came time to describe Lord Voldemort.
He didn’t have a nose (basically like Voldemort in the movie) and he was wearing all black but it was obvious he wasn’t gothic.
Zach of Cabbs 1:06:58
Not the book, because books are lame, and I didn't read them.
Christina Kann 1:07:01
It was…… Voldemort!
Zach of Cabbs 1:07:04
It'd be like if I was doing my mythology retelling—which is so popular these days; everybody's gotta have a myth retelling—and I did Hercules and I was like, "He had a swirly leather skirt thing and a tank top, you know, like the Disney version of Hercules. It was Hercules!"
Christina Kann 1:07:29
That's a good parallel analogy example.
Zach of Cabbs 1:07:35
Good job. These drinks are strong.
Brooke Matherly 1:07:38
She frequently uses "shot" or "shooted" as a dialogue tag.
Christina Kann 1:07:44
Yes, I love that. It's adorable.
Haley Simpkiss 1:07:46
Also, people just keep shooting each other in this. Blade shows up at one point.
Brooke Matherly 1:07:50
Also there are a lot of guns.
Christina Kann 1:07:52
It gets very confusing.
Zach of Cabbs 1:07:56
This was a very dramatic and extremely good moment from the internet historian version:
“Abra Kedavra!” he yelled at Snape and Loopin pointing his womb. I took my gun and shot Snape and Loopin a gazillion times and they both started screaming and the camera broke. Suddenly, Dumblydore ran in. “Ebony, it has been revealed that someone has - NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!” he shouted looking at Snape and Loopin and then he waved his wand and suddenly…"
And that's when Hagrid shows up, and he's like, "I'm a student!" Being shot a gazillion times on their wands while they try to take pervy pictures of Ebony is just like--
Haley Simpkiss 1:08:39
Oh, while Lupin is outside the window masticating, you mean?
Brooke Matherly 1:08:47
And then she addresses it. She clearly got some feedback or comments, and the next time she says in her author's note, "See? I spelled it right this time."
Christina Kann 1:08:58
She didn't spell it right, though.
Zach of Cabbs 1:09:00
Every time she gets snarky with the reader about a spelling error she made, she misspells the word again. It's almost never actually corrected.
Christina Kann 1:09:09
Some people just like really don't give a shit about spelling whatsoever. We have to acknowledge that they exist. You know what I mean?
Zach of Cabbs 1:09:20
They are so indignant about the fact. They're like, "Why would you care that I'm spelling this word wrong five different ways? Fuck you and your elitist need to spell things right."
Brooke Matherly 1:09:33
Haley, this is a thing I need your expertise on. She keeps referencing in her author's notes for people to stop "flaming."
Haley Simpkiss 1:09:45
Christina Kann 1:09:45
I had to google it.
Brooke Matherly 1:09:47
What are we talking about here?
Zach of Cabbs 1:09:49
This is a fanfiction.net OG terminology here.
Haley Simpkiss 1:09:53
Fanfiction still kind of has its own set of terms, but back in the aughts, "flaming" just meant reviews. Porn was "lemons." It was all shit like that.
Zach of Cabbs 1:10:10
It was more than just criticism. It was like, you're angry. "I'm angry that I sat there and read this whole thing."
Haley Simpkiss 1:10:19
Yeah. There were people who made entire hobbies out of just going around and sending flames to people.
Brooke Matherly 1:10:28
You read this as it was coming out. Is that accurate? Were people engaging with this heavily?
Haley Simpkiss 1:10:36
Zach of Cabbs 1:10:37
I remember the OG posting of this. I didn't follow it as it was coming out, but I definitely remember going to the OG link on fanfiction.net to read it.
Haley Simpkiss 1:10:46
Yep, I definitely read this on fanfic.net.
Brooke Matherly 1:10:49
Okay, so what kind of crowd reaction was this getting? Can you walk us through that?
Haley Simpkiss 1:10:55
Just similarly poorly spelled. Some people were telling her in good faith, "Hey, this isn't really how Harry Potter works." Drink. There was one dude who had a form flame he used for everybody that was just like, "Your parents must be inbred clowns." Shit like that. It was stupid. It was stupid then, and it's stupid now. But it was a whole cultural thing on fanfiction.net in the bad old days.
Christina Kann 1:11:36
When you say "flamers," I think of in Avatar: the Last Airbender when he says "Flameo, hotman!"
Haley Simpkiss 1:11:42
I think that might honestly be part of the reason we stopped using that term. It's too easy.
Brooke Matherly 1:11:49
She also notes that she will continue writing if she gets a certain number of reviews.
Christina Kann 1:11:55
So yeah, hold them hostage. Make them hold themselves hostage.
Zach of Cabbs 1:11:59
I will only release the next chapter if I get 15 good reviows.
Brooke Matherly 1:12:05
I'm just imagining a Game of Thrones situation, where in order to get more of the story, you have to vow yourself to fight to the death in the rink against the flamers for this. For the honor of this fanfic.
Zach of Cabbs 1:12:18
I want to cut together excerpts of this that fit into haikus. Haikus of My Immortal, copyright Zachary Urtes. That's my idea. That's mine.
Brooke Matherly 1:12:26
You need to establish a Twitter account now, before this episode comes out.
Christina Kann 1:12:30
Get it quickly.
Haley Simpkiss 1:12:33
That's part of the tragedy of this fanfic being taken down: no one's quite sure if it was taken down by the mods or if it was by a hacker. In 2008 there was this thing called, I think, Critics United. It was just a bunch of conservative Christians who would go around reporting any story they didn't like for any reason—"This has gay stuff." "This kind of talked about sex." "This character was wearing a revealing outfit!"—and report them to the mods.
Christina Kann 1:13:00
Wow, this checks all the boxes.
Zach of Cabbs 1:13:02
I mean, you joke, but also it mentions Satan. Almost every chapter talks about how much all the characters love Satan. So a Christian person would be rightly perturbed.
Haley Simpkiss 1:13:14
Yeah, it could very well have been something like that. But that's why people don't really use fanfiction.net anymore, because that happened, and then all of the porn got kicked off. Tale as old as time; song as old as rhyme.
Zach of Cabbs 1:13:28
The dying ashes of both Tumblr and OnlyFans would like to speak to you right now.
Haley Simpkiss 1:13:37
OnlyFans was saved, as far as I know.
Zach of Cabbs 1:13:39
OnlyFans backpedaled, but no one's gonna fucking trust them as a platform now. There's 15 other platforms that popped up in the past week that everyone's fleeing to right now. OnlyFans is dead. Anyway, I'm mad—not because I watched a lot of porn, but because I care about sex workers.
Brooke Matherly 1:13:56
Oh, see, I was actually assuming it was because your OnlyFans was getting shut down.
Zach of Cabbs 1:13:59
That's right! My feet pics are not getting any more traction. It's terrible.
Haley Simpkiss 1:14:03
I was mad about the porn getting taken down.
Brooke Matherly 1:14:07
Amateur porn is better than produced porn every single day.
Haley Simpkiss 1:14:09
You're right. That's the thing: There's some really good fanfiction out there. A lot of it is erotic. I can't read published erotic fiction because I know how much better stuff is out there for free.
Zach of Cabbs 1:14:23
I want my porn to be produced and profited off of by the person that's doing the fuckin. That person doing the fuckin? They should be the one controlling their content.
Christina Kann 1:14:34
I want to talk about the music choices in this just a little bit. They talk about Good Charlotte a lot. They mention Simple Plan and Evanescence, obviously. But My Chemical Romance, I think, is The One. The song they mention by far the most is "Helena" by My Chemical Romance. I think they mention that a good 10 times. I personally fucking love that song. It's one of my favorite songs of all time. It's so good and sexy, and in fact, I've been known to say that if I had a daughter I'd name her Helena. Was it partially because the song made it sound cute? Maybe.
Haley Simpkiss 1:15:34
Also, the music video was pretty good. I'm not really that into music genres; I don't know a lot about music. But Tara—Ebony—Enoby—goes on and on and on about how much of a goth she is. But "goth" is a genre of music, and almost none of the bands she's referencing are technically goth. They're mostly punk rock or emo.
Brooke Matherly 1:16:04
What Haley just did there was a little bit of gatekeeping for the music choices in My Immortal.
Zach of Cabbs 1:16:16
It's no Cats (2019), but come on.
Haley Simpkiss 1:16:19
This is just something that I read. Again, I know nothing about that stuff, but it's just another layer of this being incorrect.
Brooke Matherly 1:16:26
So you did correct yourself just there, and I do think we need to talk about this: Is this character's name actually Ebony or is it Enoby?
Christina Kann 1:16:35
I think it's Enoby?
Haley Simpkiss 1:16:39
If you ran a word search for Ebony versus Enoby, I think Enoby would outnumber it. On the official My Immortal wiki, it's used interchangeably.
Zach of Cabbs 1:16:51
God, is this like a Berenstain Bears situation? Our universes are split between Ebony and Enoby?
Haley Simpkiss 1:16:58
No, no, no, no, because the Berenstain/Berenstein thing is a memory situation, whereas with this, you can see the disparity between chapters.
Zach of Cabbs 1:17:12
What if the writer has been traveling between these two dimensions and is getting confused?
Haley Simpkiss 1:17:20
She's just a walking thin spot between dimensions?
Zach of Cabbs 1:17:24
Yes, she's constantly shifting between the planes. That's my new headcanon.
Haley Simpkiss 1:17:31
That's where she is. That's why we can't find her. She's in the other reality. She's in the Enoby universe.
Zach of Cabbs 1:17:36
In the other universe, perfect grammar sounds like a cringy horrible teen that doesn't know anything about how to write proper sentences.
Haley Simpkiss 1:17:45
And over there, it's Berenstein Bears and Nelson Mandela's alive. Or dead. Where are we? Which reality are we in?
Brooke Matherly 1:17:54
We're in the worst one. We're in the worst reality.
Zach of Cabbs 1:17:57
We're in the darkest timeline.
Brooke Matherly 1:17:58
We're 19 months into a pandemic. Afghanistan just imploded as a country.
Zach of Cabbs 1:18:03
I made you all paper goatees to put on. We're all on the evilest, darkest timeline.
Brooke Matherly 1:18:08
We have rampant inflation. For some reason, it's not fixing anything. Our world is--
Christina Kann 1:18:14
Brooke, the patrons pay for these episodes. They have to be fun.
Zach of Cabbs 1:18:18
Literally the whole world is on fire. Okay, let's move on. We're back in Hogwarts with the gothic people.
Brooke Matherly 1:18:22
Our patrons know the world is chaos.
Christina Kann 1:18:25
I just came across a particular dialogue tag that I highlighted. "Gadgeted"? "He gadgeted uncomfortably"? So that's a fun one.
Haley Simpkiss 1:18:37
What was that? supposed? to be?
Brooke Matherly 1:18:44
I actually think that was a moment where one of the characters turned into one of the cars from Cars (2006). Because it was a car from the Cars universe, they had to be gadgeted back into reality. You know, sometimes you fiddle with the radio, you’re gadgeting it.
Haley Simpkiss 1:18:59
Wait, did this character turn into the DeLorean? Because that did turn up at one point.
Christina Kann 1:19:03
That literally turned up!
Brooke Matherly 1:19:05
It's either that or Tow Mater. So...
Zach of Cabbs 1:19:08
When I was a young tweenage boy, I wanted to be a writer. And I wrote several manuscripts. I thought, "Hey, look, Christopher Paolini did it with Eragon, so I can be a kid writer too! I'm gonna start writing a book." And I thought, "Well, what's going to make my writing interesting? Whatever I'm interested in right the fuck now, obviously! So I'm just gonna take everything I'm interested in on this particular day and jam it into this chapter. And it's not gonna have anything to do with anything else. But it's interesting to me. So it must be interesting to the people who are going to read it." And I see that all over the place in My Immortal with how things just come and go and interests pass and fade. You almost get a sense for who this teenage girl is as she's writing this fanfiction.
Haley Simpkiss 1:20:07
In all fairness, Moby Dick is also exactly like that. Also, side note, if you're someone who, at any point, particularly at your old age, starts thinking, "Maybe I'm gonna write a children's book"—there's more to it than watching a nature documentary about an interesting animal and coming up with a story where it lives in your hometown for no reason. That's just a thing that I feel like everyone should be aware of.
Brooke Matherly 1:20:35
Does it change your opinion if I can find an alliterative title?
Haley Simpkiss 1:20:39
Brooke Matherly 1:20:39
What if it's Toby the Turtle or Doreen the Dolphin?
Haley Simpkiss 1:20:44
Zach of Cabbs 1:20:44
No one wants to read my story about Lucy the Elephant Blogger?
Haley Simpkiss 1:20:50
No, and no one wants to edit it either.
Brooke Matherly 1:20:53
It would actually be Eleanor the Elephant Blogger. Those are the rules of children's books with animals. I can't explain it.
Zach of Cabbs 1:21:02
It's triumphelephant, that book.
Christina Kann 1:21:04
Oh, my God, way to bring it full circle. I don't know why I was thinking about this question, but does this text—and perhaps even the lore around it—pass the Bechdel Test?
Zach of Cabbs 1:21:18
Very good question.
Brooke Matherly 1:21:19
Zach of Cabbs 1:21:20
At some point, Tara and Raven have to talk about what they're wearing. Right?
Christina Kann 1:21:23
I think it does pass.
Brooke Matherly 1:21:26
Christina Kann 1:21:29
Raven and Tara are part of the canon.
Zach of Cabbs 1:21:33
Raven and Ebony have to talk about what they're wearing at some point.
Brooke Matherly 1:21:39
They don't, though. The only interactions Ebony has with another ostensibly female character is B'loody Mary. Okay, this is a technicality thing. They do talk about how hot they are to each other. Do we consider that passing the Bechdel Test, as it is technically not about men? Or is it not passing the Bechdel Test because it is clearly done within the context of the male gaze?
Zach of Cabbs 1:22:08
That's the most depressing feminist question I've ever heard in my entire life.
Christina Kann 1:22:12
You're right about that. I just feel like the Raven-and-author back-and-forth is also part of the canon of this narrative. And to me, that is what passes the Bechdel Test, because they're talking about craft and art.
Haley Simpkiss 1:22:26
And the sweater! They argue about the sweater.
Christina Kann 1:22:29
Men don't come up except that they're in this story that they're writing together. But like, men pop up everywhere, you know? They have to be in the story. To me, that's how this passes the Bechdel Test.
Haley Simpkiss 1:22:41
The feud over the sweater.
Zach of Cabbs 1:22:42
Tara is clearly not a Harry Potter fan at all, and I see some choices when she went, "You know what? Fuck it. I want them all to be from Slytherin because Slytherin is the only cool one," or whatever. But we see little things that have to just be, "I watched this movie absentmindedly once, and I don't actually know." Mr. Norris and Fletch or whatever? Fletch is the name of the cat, and Mr. Norris is the name of the janitor who goes through the halls.
Christina Kann 1:23:15
Isn't it Filth?
Brooke Matherly 1:23:17
It's Filth, which I like better. Mr. Norris and Filth is the correct choice.
Christina Kann 1:23:27
How about the drug use in this? I highlighted this one sentence: "We did pot, coke and crack," with no Oxford comma.
Haley Simpkiss 1:23:38
"Everything that my mom said would make me go to hell, I'm just gonna put it in here!"
Zach of Cabbs 1:23:44
"And then I masticated and my hands got hairy. Oh no!"
Haley Simpkiss 1:23:47
"And I went blind!"
Christina Kann 1:23:50
The next thing I highlighted was, "We had you-know-what to a Linkin Park Song."
Haley Simpkiss 1:23:55
Oh yeah, there are a couple of times where she's mad at Draco and then he just drops to his knees and starts singing Good Charlotte at her until she forgives him.
Brooke Matherly 1:24:05
Here's the thing: if that had happened to me while I was in middle school in the middle of the hallway in between classes, I would have been like, "Yep, this is perfect. Life has peaked."
Christina Kann 1:24:16
I feel like I've been slowly laughing to the point of weeping this whole episode. I've been giggling so steadily.
Haley Simpkiss 1:24:25
Are you guys aware of the "Again, weird, but not technically a sin" meme? Someone will talk about something very weird they did that's not morally wrong but definitely strange, and then someone will respond as a priest that this is being confessed to, "That's weird, but once again, that is not a sin." That was how I felt watching the Sarah Z videos about this just for two hours straight alone.
Zach of Cabbs 1:25:06
There's this part here where Snake, who is referred to--
Haley Simpkiss 1:25:10
Or Snoop, or Snap?
Zach of Cabbs 1:25:14
Snake and Loopin were in da middle of da empty hall, doin it, and Dobby was watching!1
Brooke Matherly 1:25:23
Once again, this should have been a threesome.
Zach of Cabbs 1:25:26
That scene got me to a half-mast. I'm not gonna lie. It was described so sexily that I couldn't help but become aroused.
Haley Simpkiss 1:25:34
Why are Snape and Lupin always hanging out in this? It's like they're besties.
Christina Kann 1:25:38
I know! Here's the next thing I highlighted: "if ur a homophone den fuk of!" Okay, all homophones get out!
Zach of Cabbs 1:25:50
What is a homophone?
Brooke Matherly 1:25:51
It's two words that sound like each other.
Christina Kann 1:25:54
Like "sofa king" and "so fucking."
Zach of Cabbs 1:25:56
Oh, gotcha, gotcha. Interesting. So fucking fuck off.
Brooke Matherly 1:26:03
At some point, we must cut ourselves off.
Christina Kann 1:26:07
Yeah, it's time to wrap it up.
Zach of Cabbs 1:26:10
You mean we're not gonna keep going for five more hours? I have more notes.
Brooke Matherly 1:26:14
This could be a separate level of Patreon content, where we just go through line by line. We would have two years' worth of content.
Christina Kann 1:26:23
There's so many layers here.
Haley Simpkiss 1:26:24
No! Do not give the listeners ideas, Brooke. Don't give them ideas! They'll ask us to do it!
Zach of Cabbs 1:26:30
In college, I would read this fic until I’d have to go, "Okay, stop." And then I would rant about some particular thing. And then I would get back to reading, and then I would say, "Stop," and I would rant. And by two hours in, I would only be on chapter five.
Christina Kann 1:26:45
Okay, we're gonna wrap this up. But before we go, I want everyone to read one line that they like. Can we do that?
Brooke Matherly 1:26:53
I don't have the text in front of me.
Zach of Cabbs 1:26:55
Hold on. I'm looking. I'm scanning through my favorites.
Brooke Matherly 1:27:02
There was a point where she was describing a dress with red lace all over it. And the problem was that I read that and thought, "Oh yeah, I know what you're talking about" immediately. I was like, "I know that goth dress."
Christina Kann 1:27:15
Yeah, that's the thing that I would give the award to in this: costume description. Really excellent; I could envision all of them very well.
Zach of Cabbs 1:27:25
I am shocked that no one has done a Drunk-History-style, live action retelling of this. I have a passage to read.
Brooke Matherly 1:27:36
This passage comes from . . . Are you gonna give us our chapter and verse?
Zach of Cabbs 1:27:39
“Crookshanks!” I shouted at him. Voldemort fell of his broom and started to scream. I felt bad for him even though I’m a sadist so I stopped.
Christina Kann 1:27:56
Haley Simpkiss 1:27:57
I grabbed a steak and almost stuck it into my heart to commit suicide. I was so fucking depressed! I got out of the bathtub and put on a black low-cut dress with lace all over it sandly. I put on black high heels with pink metal stuff on the ends and six pairs of skull earrings. I couldn’t fucking believe it. Then I looked out the window and screamed… Snap was spying on me and he was taking a video tape of me! And Loopin was masticating to it! They were sitting on their broomsticks.
Zach of Cabbs 1:28:39
So good. I feel inspired. I'm gonna go write. I'm gonna go work on my manuscript.
Christina Kann 1:28:46
Wait, I have to compose myself so I can read mine.
Zach of Cabbs 1:28:50
Don't laugh or you lose. If Christina laughs, we all drink.
Christina Kann 1:28:54
*cackling and weeping constantly*
“Oh my fucking god, where’s Draco!!!!111 How did Snap get back here!!! I tohot he wuz in Azerbaijan.” I asked sadly.
Brooke Matherly 1:29:25
Christina. Christina. Focus. What was the last thing I said in our last chapter of Prisoner of Azkaban?
Brooke Matherly (flashback clip) 1:29:34
I just want to say that I've been waiting this whole book to try to see if there's a way I could naturally make a "Prisoner of Azerbaijan" reference, and it never came up, so I'm just gonna leave it here.
Christina Kann 1:29:45
We got there!
Brooke Matherly 1:29:47
That is meant to be Azkaban, I guarantee it. That is spell correct being like, "Azerbaijan???"
Zach of Cabbs 1:29:55
"I don't fucking know."
Brooke Matherly 1:29:59
I understood you, Tara.
Haley Simpkiss 1:30:04
So are we still of the opinion that this is a completely earnest effort?
Brooke Matherly 1:30:09
Christina Kann 1:30:10
I think it was! That's the craziest part of this whole thing: I think it was earnest.
Brooke Matherly 1:30:15
It's gotta be.
Zach of Cabbs 1:30:16
I think it began in earnest, and at some point late into the making of it, maybe it became a little more self-aware. But for the most part, I think it was earnest, yeah. It began in earnest.
Haley Simpkiss 1:30:26
I still don't know. I still simply do not know.
Christina Kann 1:30:33
Haley, thank you so much for taking us on this journey.
Haley Simpkiss 1:30:36
Thank you for coming with me. I'm glad that we all got to share this bonding experience. I'd say I'm sorry, but you guys tricked me into watching Cats (2019). Zach, I'm sorry, but you'd already read it. You guys tricked me into watching Cats (2019), so this is just vengeance.
Christina Kann 1:30:48
Haley Simpkiss 1:30:50
We're square now.
Zach of Cabbs 1:30:52
I'm gonna go read My Immortal again for fun even though we're done recording.
Brooke Matherly 1:30:56
Are you okay?
Christina Kann 1:30:58
It was great fun.
Zach of Cabbs 1:31:00
Really quick, I want to plug a another terrible fanfic you can find a very famous video of on YouTube called Half-Life Full-Life Consequences. Worth a watch.
Haley Simpkiss 1:31:10
Oh, you just unlocked a very deep memory.
Zach of Cabbs 1:31:14
Very, very good Half-Life fanfic from someone who is not only a child, but clearly not a native English speaker. It's rough but very funny.
Christina Kann 1:31:24
Haley, thank you so much for leading us. Brooke, thank you for being here. As always, this is your burden. Zach, you're a special guest. Thank you for what I assume was a pleasure to you. I don't know.
Zach of Cabbs 1:31:42
I had a great time.
Christina Kann 1:31:43
And that's My Immortal.
Haley Simpkiss 1:31:44
Haley Simpkiss 1:31:47
And finally, please enjoy this owl mail from our best good buddy, Mats:
After relistening to y'all's bonus episode on the absolute magnum opus of literature that is My Immortal, I have a theory.
[Sounds of people gasping in shock]
Tara Gilesbie is actually Tara Reid, renowned actress known from critically acclaimed movies such as the Sharknado franchise.
That's my thesis statement.
My theory is that Tara Reid loved writing fanfiction when she was younger (usually under the pseudonym "Tara Gilesbie"), and after many failed attempts, she had finally something worthy of being remembered for. After finishing it, she turned the story she wrote into a horcrux by placing a fragment of her soul—a memory of Tara Gilesbie—inside of it, to preserve the story as well as her secret identity. It will now be remembered until the end of time. Kind of adds another layer to the title, doesn't it?
And that is who wrote this masterpiece of a fanfiction, and how it's been able to live in our brains for so long.
Anyway, I hope you all have a lovely day! Love you all!
I have the honor to be your obedient servant,
M dot Fur
PS. I'm sorry you had to read this piece of utter nonsense. Hopefully it didn't break your brain.
PPS. Do you think that ~80 years from now, they will release a My Immortal 100-year anniversary leatherbound edition? Because if so, I'm totally buying it.
PLEASE tell us what you think of this fanfic, its lore, and/or this episode in the comments.
Mats Furuli, Lelia Hilton, Christina Kann
Christina Kann 00:22
Hi, my name is Christina, and when my cats are mad at me, I snuggle them!
Lelia Hilton 00:29
My name is Leila, and I pooped on the potty like a big girl today!
Mats Furuli 00:36
Hi, I'm Mats, and I'm just happy to be here!
Lelia Hilton 00:43
Not what I was... Improv!
Christina Kann 00:47
Hey, gang. Welcome to the Restricted Section. It is me, your host, Christina. And for those who can't tell already, today we're covering the music -- the off-Broadway play, Puffs. I almost said "the musical." There's no music.
Lelia Hilton 01:02
I keep thinking it's a musical too, even though I've seen it.
Christina Kann 01:06
I am joined today by my beloved Lelia.
Lelia Hilton 01:09
Christina Kann 01:11
Hello, hello. And we also have a returning special guest, Mats.
Mats Furuli 01:16
Christina Kann 01:18
Hi, Mats. We're so happy you're here.
Mats Furuli 01:21
I'm so happy to be here.
Christina Kann 01:22
The reason that all three of us are here today is because we are all three Puffs.
Lelia Hilton 01:29
We're number 4!
Christina Kann 01:33
So yes, I wanted to get all of us together to talk about the play Puffs. I was taking notes at first, but I quickly realized that it was kind of a futile endeavor. Like while I was watching it, I was like, there's no way I can type everything that's happening because this movie, this play, is essentially the entire series of events of the entire Harry Potter series from the Hufflepuffs' perspective. But it's like a parody. So the four houses are Braves, Smarts, Snakes, and Puffs. And like, what are the Hufflepuffs doing? There's this guy named Wayne who's the main character, and he's just like so deeply unspecial. They're just having a great time, and fuckin Harry's just floppin around getting plot done.
Mats Furuli 02:33
Like completely by accident.
Christina Kann 02:40
So much of the reason that this play was even on my radar is because you've mentioned it a lot. And you want to tell everyone a little bit about like, when did you see it? Where did you hear about it from? What's your experience been?
Mats Furuli 02:57
I don't know when the first time I ever heard about it was, but the first time I decided that I wanted to watch it was when Mike Schubert, host of Potterless, decided to cover it on his podcast earlier this year or like late 2020. He ran out of books, so he's covering all the extra material. I know he's been doing My Immortal recently. Yeah. Just wonderful. Just horrible. Wonderful. Yeah. And yeah, I watched it. And it was just wonderful. It blew my mind in just the most wonderful, wholesome way possible. And yeah, my life is so much better because of because of this play.
Christina Kann 04:02
Me too. So um, Lelia and I both watched it for the first time this week. And Lelia, what are your initial feelings?
Lelia Hilton 04:13
I was fortunate enough to watch it with Haley. And Haley is a great person to watch anything with because yeah, she's so smart and funny. And so, you know, she gave me a lot of great insight. I watched it with Haley and Jason, who are both strong Ravenclaws. Yeah. And they were just like both looking at me like knowingly the whole time.
Christina Kann 04:43
I felt the same way. I watched it with Sean, who's a Slytherin, and the whole time I just kept like realizing that I was laughing so hard and looking back to make sure he was having fun. Like I feel like such a Puff.
Lelia Hilton 05:01
It's such a Puff move. I feel like immediately after that, I did something super Puffy too. I mean, that's just my whole life. You know, we just care a little bit more about, like, just just hanging out and like, friendship and not being a threat. Puff formation 4!
We are not a threat! Please be our friend!
Christina Kann 05:29
Oh, I just really relate. So, there was one character--I'm just gonna get this out of the way. There was one character in Puffs that I particularly related to, and I had this feeling and then Sean was like, "That girl is you." And then Haley also texted me that that girl was me. And it's Big Stupid, Leanne.
Mats Furuli 05:52
I knew it!
Christina Kann 05:55
She's she is, um, what is the name of that girl from Wizards of Waverly Place? You know?
Lelia Hilton 06:00
Oh, my God. Yes, Harper.
Christina Kann 06:02
Lelia Hilton 06:03
Why do I know that?
Christina Kann 06:05
Just like a big adorable idiot. And I'm like, okay. She's like wearing a tutu and dancing around the stage. And I was like, it's kind of annoying that she reminds me of myself until at the end, she gives the speech that moves all the Puffs to stay and fight Voldemort. And then I was like I am Leanne!
Lelia Hilton 06:26
You are, and even like, down to the way she was dressed. And even her hairstyle, like everything. Everything about her. Haley for sure would not stop talking about that. She was just like, "I mean, tell me that's not Christina." And that's my best Haley impression, sorry Haley. And then she was like, "Guys, tell me that--" What's the main character's name again?
Mats Furuli 06:55
Lelia Hilton 06:56
Just like, "Tell me that Wayne doesn't look like kind of a lot like Sean." And I was like, "Oh my god, he does." They're both there!
Christina Kann 07:10
Okay, Mats, which character in Puffs do you most relate to?
Mats Furuli 07:14
Oh, um, I'm probably going to have to say Wayne for that one. The pop culture stuff.
Christina Kann 07:22
Oh yeah, he had like good t-shirts. Ninja Turtles and something else.
Lelia Hilton 07:28
They were so cute. I loved that he would always do like some kind of DIY cut-out that made it somehow Puffy.
Mats Furuli 07:39
That is one of my notes as well: Wayne's shirts are my absolute favorite.
Lelia Hilton 07:45
What are some specific examples, Mats? If you can remember?
Mats Furuli 07:48
Oh, yeah, one of them is Wolverine, but it's like, tape like a badger head. Another one, I think, is Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure, but it's Wayne, Oliver, and Megan.
Lelia Hilton 08:09
Mats Furuli 08:14
Christina Kann 08:16
Lelia, who do you relate the most to?
Lelia Hilton 08:20
I don't know. I related kind of to all of them as a group. I feel like I'm maybe more of a Megan. I'm not like as edgy or cool as her in any way--
Christina Kann 08:35
Lelia Hilton 08:36
--but I am very dramatic, as we all know.
Christina Kann 08:39
She was so dramatic. Megan was like, "We're fighting!" and everyone's like, "Why? We don't have to."
Lelia Hilton 08:47
Maybe not, though. She's like, a little scarier than me. Maybe I would also be like a diet version of Leanne.
Christina Kann 08:59
Yeah, I did really love like, the pack mentality of the Puffs. It's like, we're in this together. I related to it so big. Like, they don't care about winning, because they're together. I've never related to anything more in my life.
Lelia Hilton 09:21
Me too. I grew up in a sports family. Like, they've all played in college or in high school, all throughout their lives. And like multiple sports, so many sport things. And I never did one sport for me, not one. It was all about theater and drama and chorus and things like that. Oh, man. Yeah, ever. I'm like lazy and don't want to exert myself and have no hand-eye coordination. Other than that, the main reason I never was interested is like, I just really don't care for that type of competition. It just doesn't do anything for me. I feel like it can just be a little mean, you know?
Christina Kann 10:19
Yeah. I completely agree. It's the yelling. Like being at a sporting event, the yelling is so aggressive. Okay, here's the thing: When people yell because of sports, they make my empathy alarms go off. I'm like, "Oh no, human in distress," but it's about like a very inconsequential thing that is like so far removed from our existence that I'm like, "But wait, my brain says this is stupid." Like the intersection of those two?
Lelia Hilton 10:51
Yeah, I get it. I think people focus too much on competition, instead of like the experience.
Mats Furuli 11:00
Just having fun.
Lelia Hilton 11:05
So it's like we're number three, or even maybe we're number four. Like, either way we don't care. Like, we're, we're, it's fun. We're doing it together like Cedric's here for a little while. Speaking of how did we feel about Cedric, you know, the actor that portrayed him, and then his whole little arc that happened?
Christina Kann 11:27
Okay, I there when you said Cedric, I started laughing because the actor who plays Cedric, then later plays Voldemort. And like, he looks so ridiculous in that role that I have a hard time picturing Cedric now because all I can picture is like the bathrobe and the tape on his--
Lelia Hilton 11:44
He just has tape on his nose!
Christina Kann 11:46
It's the best they could do.
Mats Furuli 11:49
Yeah, it's great. And like, honestly, I love James Foley as Cedric, and whenever I'm reading the books now, like, that's who I'm picturing as Cedric.
Christina Kann 12:07
His whole personality screams coolest Hufflepuff. Like, yeah, I guess you're cool. But like...
Lelia Hilton 12:17
Well, it's just like they say, what is it? Year Four, or the year where the Puffs mattered? It's so true, but he's much more personable and like a "cool guy" kind of Cedric. Not that we we hate on Robert Pattinson's portrayal at all.
Christina Kann 12:41
Different vibes. So okay, we said that I'm similar to Leanne. That's more of like an aesthetic. She's big dumb in a way that I'm not, right? I feel like if I was in the Puffs, I would have more of a Cedric role because I'm a little bit of a leader. I build other people up. I'm like, "Come on, let's go. We're gonna get fourth place."
Mats Furuli 13:05
I'm not in any way a leader.
Lelia Hilton 13:07
I just thought about the part when Cedric opens up the egg. It's just a guy screaming!
Mats Furuli 13:14
Oh, it's so good.
Lelia Hilton 13:19
I think I almost wet my pants. For listeners, the part in the books and in the movies when they open up the egg for the triwizard tournament and like, when it's not underwater, it's it's like a very terrifying scream, and in the play it's um, it's literally just like a dude offstage, like probably Wayne or one of them just like going like *screams*
Christina Kann 13:53
Honestly, this whole play had me dying laughing from the hilarious references like that to the original text. The plot that the pumps go down is like a totally different path from what Harry Potter and the gang are doing, but the all of the asides... Like in Goblet of Fire, Book 4 in Puffs, where Dumbledore is like, "Harry, did you put your name in this cup?" And he's like, "Nah," and Dumbledore's like, "I'm the definition of calm right now." You can't not mention it. For the Harry Potter fandom, that moment is like Viggo Mortensen breaking his toe. By law, you're required to mention it when it comes up.
Mats Furuli 14:45
Oh my god.
Christina Kann 14:46
So how do we feel like the tone of the story was different because of its perspective? Was it telling a different kind of story even?
Lelia Hilton 14:56
Christina Kann 14:56
For example, I always say that the Harry Potter narrative is a Gryffindor narrative. Like, "I am the chosen one and I need to sacrifice myself." Like so Gryffindor. But in contrast, I always say Avatar: The Last Airbender, that's a Hufflepuff series. Because it's about like, how do I do my job and protect the people I love without hurting anybody? You know what I mean? Like, how do I find balance? And that's like big Hufflepuff vibes. If so, like, how did the the context switch when our main characters switched?
Lelia Hilton 15:03
Um, I mean, one of the biggest things is just really seeing how much of a minor role like Harry -- it just kind of shows you the perspective of the entire story, and just like how Harry's quest and how Harry's arc really kind of fucked up, everybody else's life.
Christina Kann 15:54
The play Puffs kind of framed it as if Harry was going on side quests that were fucking up the main quest, you know, it's like, dude, you gotta stop. Like, we're trying to just go to school here.
Mats Furuli 16:09
Yeah, while the Harry Potter books are very much a like "chosen one," Puffs, in contrast, is like, this one guy wanting so badly to be the Chosen One, the hero, and he's having to come to grips with the fact that we're all in this together, like, having to learn that whole mentality. And yeah, I think, like as a Hufflepuff myself, I think it's a really nice mentality to have.
Christina Kann 16:58
Lelia Hilton 16:59
Well, just like in Hamilton, you know, we have no control who lives, who dies, who tells our story.
Mats Furuli 17:14
There is literally a quote from Puffs, where the narrator goes, "Who lives, who dies," and every time I'm watching him, like, "Who tells your story?"
Lelia Hilton 17:29
*singing* "I tell your story."
Christina Kann 17:31
Okay. We can't do this. Because when that part of Hamilton comes up I am sobbing. Like she lives on to tell his story. It was her story the whole time! Okay. Sorry, sorry,
Lelia Hilton 17:42
*singing* "Let me tell you what I'm proudest of."
Mats Furuli 17:45
*singing* "The orphanage!"
Christina Kann 17:45
Okay, shut up. Don't TALK TO ME ABOUT THE ORPHANAGE! So I also really love how this is, this is the opposite of a "chosen one" story. It's like the chosen one in this story is like, an like a non-entity. And it's like, you cannot just sit around waiting for the chosen one. And you also can't thrust yourself into the spotlight and be the chosen one. You have to look around who is standing beside you and make a promise to work together to protect each other. And that's when I started crying at the end, when they all decide when Leanne gives her speech, and it's like, this is what Puffs do, is they just like, they protect what they love. And they do it together.
Mats Furuli 18:41
What you said is exactly why I love the portrayal of Harry's character in this play as well, because you can't want to be in the spotlight. And then like on the other hand, Harry's just like stumbling into the spotlight just succeeding without really meaning to.
Christina Kann 19:05
Yes, "stumbling" is a perfect word. I feel like the actor who played Harry in this was like a drunk toddler just like walking around, like wandering into danger or wandering out of danger. Also, if you're listening to this, you haven't seen it yet, just stop and go watch it. Because like the things that we're describing are so much funnier seen than described.
Mats Furuli 19:30
Yeah I have a really had time in any way shape or form describing or like doing this play justice. Like you're you're going to have to watch it.
Christina Kann 19:40
There is no like describing live theatre and I mean, this is a particular one where it's like, you got to experience.
Mats Furuli 19:48
A hundred percent. And I just want to add that Madeline Bundy, who plays Harry and Moaning Myrtle -- I just love the fact that the same person plays Harry and Moaning Myrtle -- but also Susie Bones, also was the lead set designer, prop designer, and costume designer for this play. It's wild.
Christina Kann 20:18
That is so crazy. So that brings me to a good point is that I mean, at least from a spectators perspective, watching this you can tell that every actor plays like 15 different characters, and it's like so impressive when the whole cast comes out at the end. You're like "Oh, yeah, there's only like 10 of these guys running around the stage like maniacs the whole time," but they each do such a good job. There's that one actor who plays McGonagall, Dumbledore #1, Professor Sprout, Megan's mom, every adult. She's got adult face, I guess.
Lelia Hilton 20:58
She's she's got the cheekbones.
Christina Kann 21:03
Totally. And she did Hannah Abbott too. But I think she is like the first voice that you hear in the whole play because she's doing a McGonagall voice. And I was like, "Damn, that's a really good accent."
Mats Furuli 21:15
That's a really good McGonagall impression holy shit.
Lelia Hilton 21:19
Also, the actress who plays Harry does the best Moaning Myrtle impression I think that I've ever heard. Like, we were dying.
Christina Kann 21:30
It's very good. Just another special Harry moment. Harry's like your friend who just like always needs a hug, kind of. I feel like this version of Harry's always--
Lelia Hilton 21:41
Christina Kann 21:42
Yeah! He kisses Wayne's shoulder. He doesn't just kiss Wayne's shoulder; he kisses Wayne's shoulder four times in rapid succession. That makes it like so much cuter. Like an automatic weapon of kisses.
Lelia Hilton 21:58
And Harry in Hermione. How did you like their portrayal? How did you like the actors?
Christina Kann 22:03
Yes! That's what I was gonna bring up next.
Lelia Hilton 22:06
Ron and Hermione, sorry.
Christina Kann 22:07
Oh, yeah. When I started being like, "you have to see this because describing it is stupid," it reminded me that I was trying to get to Ronand Hermione are both played ostensibly by brooms.
Lelia Hilton 22:19
Mops? I don't know.
Christina Kann 22:20
Mats Furuli 22:21
To be fair, I think the personality of Ron's character in this play pretty much exactly fits the character in the movies.
Lelia Hilton 22:32
Yeah, you're right.
Christina Kann 22:34
Harry has his whole fight and falling out with Ron as an mop.
Mats Furuli 22:41
And then Oliver comes in, and he's like, "Okay, I'm sure you guys will be fine." And then, "Hey, look, there's no need for you to be an asshole. Jeez! You really are the worst member of your family."
Christina Kann 22:57
Oh, my God. Yeah. Have you all seen The Good Place?
Mats Furuli 23:02
Lelia Hilton 23:02
Yeah, not all of it.
Christina Kann 23:06
Did Oliver in this remind you of Chidi a little bit?
Mats Furuli 23:08
Oh my god, yeah!
Lelia Hilton 23:09
Christina Kann 23:11
Just like a little uptight. Like a little "Come on, bud, loosen up. You've got a great personality, but you're super uptight. You got to chill out."
Lelia Hilton 23:19
Oh my god, how much would that suck? Imagine being told you're a literal like mathematician, child genius. And then you're like the best student at your school. And then they're like, "Just kidding. You're going to wizard school. You suck. You're not brave or smart."
Christina Kann 23:44
Okay, like obviously not to the same extent, but like that is kind of what happened to Hermione in the book. Like she was a gifted child, right, who had devoted her life to studying, and then surprise, none of this matters to you; you have to go start over.I think that's why she was such a brat in the first book, because she is like trying to prove so hard that like she's got this, you know? Yeah. Little Oliver with his little shorts.
Lelia Hilton 24:10
And his mismatched paisley socks.
Christina Kann 24:13
Yeah. So something else that I liked about this is -- so the main trio is Wayne, who was like, you know, the stand-in for Harry. He's like the anti-chosen one. And then there's Megan, who sort of denies her Puff identity. She comes from a long family of Puffs, who wish they were Snakes, basically. And so she believes in her heart of hearts that she's an evil snake, so she hates being a Puff. And then there's Oliver, who is like a genius who learned that he's a wizard and has to start over. So one thing I really liked is how different those three characters were from each other because Harry and Ron and Hermione have a lot in common. They're all sort of dry, boring British people but also like, the way that they approach any situation is just like pretty much pure Gryffindor at all times. You know what I mean? Like they're really similar, but I felt like Megan, Wayne, and Oliver are like so different. They made a really strong trio because their skills are so different. The personalities are different. Just love them.
Lelia Hilton 25:21
Yeah, I think you're right. I love the contrast. I also think that Megan trying so so so hard to prove that she's not a Puff is just like the most Puff thing that she could have done.
Mats Furuli 25:35
Like full-on identity crisis. She goes from being a Snake in year one to "I'm into books now" in year two. And then in three, she's like, "Okay, yeah, I'm going to be with the Braves this year, because everything notable that ever happens in this school, happens to them" and then the first Brave that stumbles into the room is Neville.
Christina Kann 26:10
Yeah, and then by the end Megan is like so happy to be a Puff. And like, I relate to that. I feel like when I was younger, I was like, "Being nice is stupid. I'm smarter than everyone, I got this, and fuck you guys." I've said before that I was pretty shitty person when I was younger. And it was part of my journey that I like I'm like, yeah, Puff is the way to be. Yeah, Puff's the way to be.
Lelia Hilton 26:35
It's okay to not be the toughest or the bravest or strongest, you know, sometimes it's a little bit more special to be that person that people feel comfortable coming to and feel comfortable gathering with.
Christina Kann 26:47
Yeah, yeah, gathering. Lelia, Mats, I swear to God, we're gonna gather one day. Just you wait.
*singing* JUST YOU WAIT!
Mats Furuli 26:56
Christina Kann 27:00
Yeah, but definitely, Leila and I show a lot of love by inviting people into our home and making them eat food and get drunk basically.
Mats Furuli 27:09
I'm the biggest introvert in the history of introverts. So I cannot relate to that part. But yeah, I think I do enjoy being around people. I'm just really bad at taking initiative.
Lelia Hilton 27:23
Well, that's okay. At least for me and Christina, our best friends are pretty much all introverts because what's happened is that we've gone into the world and just kind of like forced them into our friendship.
Christina Kann 27:35
Shut up, Lelia, please tell the story of Jason and Haley.
Lelia Hilton 27:40
Oh, the vax story? Oh my god.
Christina Kann 27:45
Please, tell us a story.
Lelia Hilton 27:46
So we all know Haley, sweet Haley, can be a little shy, even though that's hard to believe for her on the podcast, but she's very introverted, as is my husband, Jason. He's as introverted as I am extroverted, basically. And they try, they do the do. And they both were going to get their second shots of their vaccines for COVID. And they both happened to have appointments at the same place and same time in Richmond, didn't know. They're standing in line, or should I say in queue?
Christina Kann 28:22
They're like five feet apart.
Lelia Hilton 28:23
They're five feet apart from each other in queue, in line. And Haley just starts sending me texts while I'm at work, and she's like, "I think that this--" I feel like I should pull it up. Just like "I think this guy that I'm seeing, he's like tall and blond and looks exactly like Jason. But like, also, it could be not Jason, because he has on his mask. And then like, What would I say? What if it wasn't? What would I do then? And then what if it was Jason, what do we do? We can't talk from there." Then she sends me a picture and she's like, "Ma'am, is this your husband?" Like, yes!
Christina Kann 29:06
Just ask him! I had like, I have like a long conversation with Haley after that. I was like, "Hey, babe, next time just be like, yo Jason!" and if he doesn't turn around, you're good. And she's like, "What if he does her? What if he's like, I'm not Jason!"
Lelia Hilton 29:20
Like, I don't think anyone would do that. But yeah, and then later, before I got home, I called Jason. I was like, "Hi, why didn't you say hi to Haley?" And he was like, "What the fuck? How did you know about that?"
Christina Kann 29:34
Okay, so the whole story is just to demonstrate that we to have friends who need their emotional support extrovert.
Lelia Hilton 29:42
And we're here for you.
Christina Kann 29:43
Oh, there was a meme going around the internet that -- well by "going around the internet" I mean, I saw it one time a long time ago. It was a Slytherin saying "Ma'am, I need that. That's my emotional support Hufflepuff." That's how I feel was Sean.
Lelia Hilton 30:01
It made me feel good about myself a little bit. Not really at first -- I mean not always because they do portray the Puffs like in a very big dumb energy
Christina Kann 30:12
Big dumb. Like all himbos.
Lelia Hilton 30:14
Christina Kann 30:16
Yeah but I agree that it was like the first time that I ever felt pride in being a Hufflepuff that wasn't in an abstract, fandom kind of way. I know this was a fan-produced show, but it was almost like giving me cannon to identify with. Which I guess is sometimes the whole point of fan-fiction, to fill in the gaps where the author has failed. And the Hufflepuffs in the Harry Potter series, with a couple exceptions, are not portrayed very well. Really it's like Gryffindor and Ravenclaw, or like go home because obviously, all Slytherins are evil, we'll get to that in a minute with the Snakes. But also the Puffs are like just kind of like jellyfish. They just suck. Justin Finch-Fletchley is just like a whiny bitch boy; just like, come on, buck up. It's a snake. You got it. And then there's Ernie MacMillan, whomst I hate so much.
Lelia Hilton 31:16
Ernie Mac in the play.
Christina Kann 31:19
Yeah. And then Justin Finch-Fletchley was J-Finch. He was like -- I don't remember what he said. He was like, "I'm boyish, like cute."
Lelia Hilton 31:27
He was always like, "I'm J-Finchin' over here." All I remember is that everybody in the play just started treating him like he was invisible.
Christina Kann 31:37
Imaginary. Yeah, because Leanne says it once. She's like, "Blah, blah, blah. And like J-Finch, he's a great wizard, even though he's imaginary." And you could see his face just be like, "Am I fuckin imaginary?"
Lelia Hilton 31:52
Very un-Puff of everyone to gang up against him.
Christina Kann 31:59
Um, so let's talk about the Snakes. The way that this play, like pokes fun at the Harry Potter series is by like, doubling down on things. So they're like, "All Snakes are evil, and that kid looks like he would throw a glass of white wine in your face," right? Which is the funniest description of anyone I've ever heard in my life.
Lelia Hilton 32:24
They all have this expression that looks like they're about to throw a glass of white wine on your face. They're all, you know, 12 but they all still share that expression.
Christina Kann 32:35
Honestly, 12-year-old Tom Felton did look like he would throw a glass of white wine in your face.
Lelia Hilton 32:45
Christina Kann 32:47
Yeah. So good casting there. Did we even see any Snakes? Were there any Snake characters? I don't even remember.
Mats Furuli 32:59
We did get a little bit of Draco.
Christina Kann 33:02
Oh, yeah. If you think Harry was joke, Draco was a goddamn joke. He had like a tiara, right? Or like a crown.
Mats Furuli 33:13
Oh and a little bit of goyle during the Sorting. Just the name "Goyle."
Christina Kann 33:20
I've thought about that before, about how Crabbe and Goyle's names are Vincent and Gregory, which are so much more attractive names. Like a man named Vincent, he could be attractive. You know what I mean? But not Crabbe.
Lelia Hilton 33:45
Also the name Vincent Crabbe just reminds me of like, a really cute animated crab named Vincent.
Christina Kann 33:53
*singing* Vincent the crab, just pinchin on shit.
Lelia Hilton 33:58
Christina Kann 34:04
Oh my god. Darwin went to the Galapagos to study the J-pinches.
Lelia Hilton 34:11
And he was disappointed.
Christina Kann 34:15
Let's talk about the teachers in this play. I think the teacher we saw the most was like -- Oh, we got to see Snape considerably. Like Snape was a joke, Snape had nothing to do with the plot. Leila is doing a gag right now. You gotta watch the play to figure out what it is. Yeah, there's a bit where Snape gives a sex ed talk. And if you think Alan Rickman's voice in the Harry Potter movies is like low and dramatic, you have no idea.
Lelia Hilton 34:49
He really sits on the quality that Alan Rickman has. I like to call it lovingly "the egg," or the old "egg yolk in the back of the throat" sound.
Christina Kann 34:59
I call it the whomping. He was womping so hard that I couldn't understand anything he said. I don't think you were supposed to.
Lelia Hilton 35:13
Christina Kann 35:14
It sounds if you're watching a movie and a grenade goes off near someone, or like a gunshot, and they have temporary hearing loss, and everything's just like, "Womp womp womp." That's what it was like.
Lelia Hilton 35:27
Christina Kann 35:28
I was like, "What is he saying?" So he was a joke, which I appreciated. It's like, we're not even gonna get into this.
Lelia Hilton 35:37
And then, he was still in love with "Lillith" in this one. Which reminds me of Frasier. If anyone likes Frasier.
Christina Kann 35:45
Oh, I have not watched Frasier.
Lelia Hilton 35:47
I highly recommend; it ages really well.
Christina Kann 35:50
I think it's good to know at age as well.
Lelia Hilton 36:04
Yeah, it does. They certainly don't all.
Christina Kann 36:09
Ain't that the truth? But you know what does age well? Puffs.
Lelia Hilton 36:14
Christina Kann 36:14
Thank you, bringing us back. And then there was that one actor who played McGonagall, Sprout, and Dumbledore #1. They switched actors for Dumbledore when the films did, which was so funny. This one actor just did like everything, like all of her different teachers' voices were so impressive, like vocal control, you know?
Lelia Hilton 36:40
Yes. And then what's up with -- what is it? Zach? What's the name of the Quidditch --
Christina Kann 36:45
Lelia Hilton 36:46
Mats Furuli 36:48
The fucking Quidditch tryouts.
Christina Kann 36:52
Did y'all watch the outtakes at the end?
Lelia Hilton 36:55
Yes, I did.
Mats Furuli 36:56
Christina Kann 36:57
So the actor was like -- they put a little subtitle on the screen, saying that the actor is allowed to come out and say whatever he wants to start the Quidditch tryouts. So this actor went on like a five-minute-long monologue describing the plot of 27 Dresses as if it had happened to him personally.
Mats Furuli 37:18
It's probably my favorite scene in the entire show -- or in the entire play -- because, like, improvised -- fucking, yeah.
Christina Kann 37:28
Hilarious, like, really the funniest shit. And at the end, during the credits, they showed some outtakes of all the different ideas. Some people are funny, dude. Improv is hard. You just got to keep talking.
Lelia Hilton 37:45
I hope it works out. Hope it's funny.
Mats Furuli 37:48
I'm really bad at improv.
Christina Kann 37:52
That's why I'm just like, so passingly okay at improv, because I can literally keep talking forever. Anyway, where even was I? Backing up... Zach Smith.. backing up. That was that was the actor who played J-Finch. All of the kids played -- I call them kids because they're Hogwarts students. All of the actors played so many different people. There was a lot of very -- Okay, so I did theater in high school. Mats, did you? Have you ever done theater?
Mats Furuli 38:29
Christina Kann 38:29
Not your vibe; I get it. And I know Lelia's done theater. Some of those quick changes were so quick. And in the beginning, I was really impressed. I mean, the whole thing is very impressive. But you quickly realize that they're all wearing like 17 layers of clothing that they keep just like rearranging. It's smart. But a couple a couple of those quick changes were like, "Oh, shit!"
Mats Furuli 38:51
Christina Kann 38:51
There was one scene where Leanne like fell off the stage and I was like, "That was kind of dumb." But one split second later, the the actress comes back on as Fleur Delacour. Like, "Oh, okay, I get it now." Like very impressive. It really took me back to high school, where I was part of the team, the Quick Change team, which is super fun if your leading man is very hot. Eric Fisher, Eric Fischer, if you're out there, love you, bud. He used to run off stage, and all the girls would be there stripping his clothes off as fast as we could, like QUICKLY! And then we'd shove him back into his like, waistcoat and cap or whatever, we'd be like, "Get out there, stud." So that was a lot of fun. And yeah, it took me right back. I just love the theater dude. It involves so much more -- obviously movies are great, but like movies have Hollywood, you know what I mean? And plays are -- you need to design every element of them to be seamless and straightforward. You know what I mean? It's like people and things need to be where they're supposed to be, everything has to work right the first time because it's live, you know. And so you can tell how aggressively they've practiced. And, like, I cannot convey enough how much every single person on the cast walked like all over the stage at all times. So there was like four or five doors -- maybe like six doors, I don't remember, four to six doors -- that they were just coming in and out of constantly. That was their set structure was these doors. There was this one moment where two of the doors across the stage from each other both open, and the two actors make eye contact, or maybe they like, shoot a spell at each other. And I was like, that precision is insane. Dude, precision.
Lelia Hilton 40:48
Yeah. I mean, I think it's, I find something extremely charming about these types of productions that are clearly done on the budget of like, a ham sandwich, you know?
Lelia Hilton 40:58
Because the thing is that it doesn't take anything away from it at all. If anything, it just adds more charm. I mean, when you see Wayne with his t-shirts, where he's literally taken like a piece of construction paper and like, drawn a badger's head and taped it to his shirt.
Christina Kann 41:19
Yeah, since we're back on this shirt subject again, the one that made me laugh is that Megan was wearing what was clearly a Nirvana shirt, but they taped over it and it just said "90s Grunge Band." I don't know why it made me laugh. I was like, "That's obviously Nirvana."
Lelia Hilton 41:41
Hers were really funny. I mean, all of the costumes, all of this sets, pretty much everything. There was nothing spectacular about any of it. It wasn't about the spectacle. It was about these actors that just worked their asses off and gave an amazing performance. The script was great. Clearly there has to have been more than one director. I mean, how...?
Christina Kann 42:05
To something like this together?
Lelia Hilton 42:07
Maybe I'm wrong. I don't know. But you're right. I mean, like, who knows how long it took everybody to practice? Cuz you're right. The thing about theater is like, in Hollywood, it's so glossy. And the actors are pretty much all stars.
Christina Kann 42:22
And it's not like that doesn't take work. But it's totally different.
Lelia Hilton 42:27
Completely different. And it's a lot more high stakes when you can't just yell "cut" and do another take.
Christina Kann 42:34
Yes, yeah, you have to learn how to do right the first time.
Lelia Hilton 42:38
And every time.
Mats Furuli 42:40
The thought of doing theater terrifies me for that reason.
Christina Kann 42:44
It's terrifying. It's terrifying. I really am not the kind of person who is prone to nerves, but it's the Puff in me, the notion of fucking up other people is like, the worst thing I could possibly imagine. It's like a lot. If I fuck up in a way that fucks other people up. I'm done.
Mats Furuli 43:04
Christina Kann 43:07
And that's why improv stresses me out a lot. When I did improv like a year or two ago now, I had such bad anxiety because it's such a team sport. You have to be giving to your scene partner, like so much. And it's like, if you fail them, then it's like, "I'm sorry. You failed because I failed first."
Lelia Hilton 43:30
Yeah, it's a it's a team effort, which is terrifying. But also like, what's more Puff? You know?
Christina Kann 43:35
Yeah, you're right. And Puffs aren't afraid of failure.
Lelia Hilton 43:39
Yeah. Well, everyone's a little afraid of failure, I think.You were talking about like, fucking up on stage. Let's see. I was in plays all throughout high school, but I went to a center for the arts high school where the actors -- where the kids; they were children; it was high school -- where the children were very serious about theater. Like, that's what they wanted to do. So, in order to get the lead in a play, you had to be like, good. You couldn't just be like the only girl who can sing there. Like, no, you had to be like a triple threat.
Christina Kann 44:18
My school was like that, too. Lelia is a little butthurt because Jason got a lot of leading roles at his other school.
Lelia Hilton 44:25
Danny in Greece. Are you serious right now?
Christina Kann 44:28
If you've met Jason -- I love the man and he's great at a lot of things. But I feel like if you've met him, you're like, "I don't see where Jason and Danny overlap." Like, where's the overlap?
Lelia Hilton 44:41
Not really what you'd think of as leading man material, but you know, just one man's opinion. I was in A Midsummer Night's Dream, the play, which was super fun. We did it -- I don't even know -- my sophomore year?
Christina Kann 44:56
That is such a fun play to put on.
Lelia Hilton 44:59
So fun and very funny, and the kids were so talented that they had the audience dying laughing at a Shakespeare play in high school. So it was wonderful. But you know, I was a nobody, so I was Peaseblossom.
Christina Kann 45:16
That's the most fun, though, is just be a fucking fairy running around.
Lelia Hilton 45:19
I was a little fairy. And there's much of the play which consists of my least favorite thing to do on stage, which is sit there and be quiet.
Christina Kann 45:29
Yeah, they do just be observing for so much of that play.
Lelia Hilton 45:33
It's hard, yo. I'm fidgety AF. And it's really hard for me to sit somewhere but still focus on what's going on. So as you can imagine, what happened was most nights when we were performing, I would just be sitting there, and I should have just been listening so that I could be ready for my, you know, like, two lines. And instead, what happened was an awful silence encompassed to the stage. And all of a sudden, I snapped back to reality and I was like, "I'm on stage" and I was like, "And I and and, and you to my Lord," or whatever my line was. Yeah, that's a terrifying feeling, to just be sitting there and then there's just silence.
Christina Kann 46:15
It's your silence.
Lelia Hilton 46:16
It's my silence.
Christina Kann 46:20
Okay, well, now that all of our listeners have a ton of anxiety in their stomachs, um, uh, who who is your favorite character in this? We already asked who did you relate the most to, but who is your favorite character?
Lelia Hilton 46:32
Uh, so hard. Mats, do you know? It's hard to pick. They're also great.
Christina Kann 46:36
Yeah, I do really like Wayne. Which is kind of weird because well, I don't really typically like the characters that I relate to, I don't think but-- Mats, love yourself.
Mats Furuli 46:51
It's hard, okay!
Lelia Hilton 46:54
Don't talk about our friend that way, Mats.
Christina Kann 46:56
Well, it's cool that the Puffs have given us a main character that is relatable. And it's like, wow, he's having a hard time with some really relatable shit. I can't relate to this prophecy bullshit, Harry, get over yourself.
Mats Furuli 47:10
Lelia Hilton 47:12
What does he say at the beginning? During the sorting hat time, he's like, "What about if like, sir, for example, like, a kid didn't have maybe like a strong enough personality for any of that?"
Mats Furuli 47:25
Yeah, didn't have enough of a personality to be sorted into anything.
Christina Kann 47:31
Your only personality trait is that you look like you're about to throw a glass of white wine in someone's face.
Lelia Hilton 47:38
Yeah, at least it's not that.
Mats Furuli 47:41
I'd rather have a bland personality than talk as though I'm about to throw a glass of wine into someone's face.
Lelia Hilton 47:50
Yeah, but just to reiterate, I don't feel that you have a bland personality at all.
Mats Furuli 47:56
Oh, certainly not. See, that's the thing. That's the thing.The way that Hufflepuffs are depicted in Harry Potter is a caricature. And once you start putting real life people into Hufflepuff house, it has like a beautiful varied personality. All shades of yellow, you know? It's beautiful. 50 shades of yellow. No.
Lelia Hilton 48:17
50 shades of yellow. Oh, that sounds --
Christina Kann 48:20
I love it. I love it. That's like -- I'm not gonna say it.
Lelia Hilton 48:24
It's pee. It's piss. It sounds like piss. It sounds like sex and piss. Just say it, Christina.
Christina Kann 48:31
No, my brain went grosser.
Lelia Hilton 48:33
Christina Kann 48:33
I don't have to say it on the podcast. Okay. No, no, I have to say it now. To me, it sounds like a diaper explosion.
Lelia Hilton 48:44
Christina Kann 48:45
Moving on. In this Zoom call, we have two shades of yellow because Mats is wearing a Restricted Section shirt, and I'm an idiot and I never think to dress up for anything, but I happen to be wearing a very deep mustard yellow button-up because I had a lot of meetings. So Mats, is that your final answer? Wayne?
Mats Furuli 49:05
Yeah, I think so.
Christina Kann 49:06
That's a strong choice. Lelia, what about you?
Lelia Hilton 49:08
I really enjoyed the actor who played Harry Potter and also Moaning Myrtle and Susie. And that was that was about it, right?
Christina Kann 49:22
You can only do so much.
Lelia Hilton 49:24
You say that, but some of them be playing like six fucking characters.
Mats Furuli 49:29
The same two people played all the teachers.
Christina Kann 49:31
Yeah, it did get confusing when like Leanne would walk offstage and then walk back onstage, and like, we're in love with her now. It's like, "Wait -- oh, she's different. She's a different person now. She's wearing different clothes. She's wearing a different hat. I get it."
Lelia Hilton 49:44
Suspension of disbelief is extremely important in a play like this, where every actor plays lots of parts. Except I don't think Wayne played anything else, except he might have been like hooded up as a Snake.
Christina Kann 49:58
I definitely saw him in a hood and I was like, that's our boy Wayne right there.
Lelia Hilton 50:03
That's my boy! Wayne, you're not a real Snake.
Christina Kann 50:07
So Lelia, pulled a Puff. I asked what your favorite character was, and you listed two actors and all six characters that they played, or whatever.
Lelia Hilton 50:16
Oh, I have to just pick one? Okay.
Christina Kann 50:17
Pick one character.
Lelia Hilton 50:19
Um, okay. Um, oh gosh, I hate that I'm doing this, but I really liked Harry.
Christina Kann 50:25
I did too.
Lelia Hilton 50:26
Mats Furuli 50:27
He was great.
Christina Kann 50:29
Harry is so much funnier in this than he ever is in Harry Potter.
Lelia Hilton 50:34
And so endearing.
Christina Kann 50:36
He's very endearing. He has, like I said, drunk toddler energy, just like confused and raring to go, you know?
Lelia Hilton 50:45
I feel like they could have gone another way with it and make Harry a little bit more like hottie.
Christina Kann 50:53
Lelia Hilton 50:53
Or Yeah, we're just make him like a little bit more -- because he is does literally like fuck up their entire lives. They could have kind of focused on that more and went a little more negative with him, but they didn't. They were just like, "I guess this is just our lives now." And then at the same time they still made Harry somebody who can kind of fit into the Puffs world.
Christina Kann 51:16
Yeah, it's almost like this Harry is the Hufflepuff perspective of book Harry. It's just a silly friend doing his best, you know, just like stumbling around getting into shenanigans. Like, you know what I mean? Cast a yellow light on the whole situation.
Lelia Hilton 51:33
Well, it's such a loving perspective.
Christina Kann 51:36
Lelia Hilton 51:37
I mean, what's the Snakes' perspective of Harry? Just like this --
Christina Kann 51:43
Lelia Hilton 51:44
Yeah, this arrogant James Potter idiot douchebag who doesn't deserve anything and is like ruining everything. And it should have been me, me, me. And then versus the Puffs' perspective is just like, "Oh, you know, like, that's our friend Harry. And like, you know, he's always getting into trouble. And he's always kind of like doing kooky things, but it's okay. Like, we're here for him if he needs."
Mats Furuli 52:09
I definitely think that Wayne gets kind of annoyed with Harry.
Lelia Hilton 52:13
Christina Kann 52:13
That's part of his arc.
Mats Furuli 52:15
Christina Kann 52:17
Because in order to become a true Puff, you need your Puffness tested, and you need to overcome it and become a stronger Puff on the other side.
Mats Furuli 52:25
Christina Kann 52:26
So I also was going to list Harry as my favorite character. I feel like that's a role where the actor brought everything to that role. You know what I mean? I think that someone with a personality that was a little different would -- like if Leanne, the actor who played Leanne -- had played Harry -- could have done it. Would have looked weird. She's like a tall-ass redhead. But it would have been like a different energy. So I feel like you can really feel the energy of that Harry actor coming through. I'll go ahead and say that my favorite character was -- this is what happens when we get to plugs every week on this fucking podcast. I'm like, uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. My favorite character -- um, I -- fuck, it's just Harry. No, no. Okay, wait. I really liked Cedric too. I don't feel like the films conveyed him as big Hufflepuff energy. He just has a "white British boy" personality like every other fucking person in that movie. Nothing about him says Hufflepuff except that he's like, "Hey, guys, maybe don't bully this younger student." You know what I mean? It's like, not quite enough. But this Cedric in Puffs was a leader and he was a sweetie and he was a tender boy and I loved him.
Lelia Hilton 53:46
Yeah, he was a wonderful leader.
Christina Kann 53:48
Yeah, he really was. He got people excited to lose. You know what I mean? Yeah, I admire him.
Mats Furuli 53:57
He's definitely one of my favorites as well.
Christina Kann 53:59
Yeah. I love every character that was different from from the original text. McGonagall was the same, a lot of the teachers were like exactly the same. Sprout at one point basically comes off the backstage high, basically, like, "What do you need? Alright, well, is everything okay? All right. Bye." Or like, whatever she said. I don't even remember that exchange.
Lelia Hilton 54:23
That's another character that that mom character plays right? She's like, "50 points from Gryffindor for upsetting my plants." From Puff -- from Hufflepuff -- from Puff. Ugh!
Christina Kann 54:41
A little Hufflepuff-n-stuff. Um, okay, so I'm gonna ask one closing question, and then we'll wrap it up. So my final question is, what was your favorite joke in Puffs that was a nod to the original text, or the movie. I keep saying "text" but like, you know what I'm saying. Which was your favorite joke that was clearly making fun of Harry Potter?
Lelia Hilton 55:03
There's so many.
Mats Furuli 55:04
Yeah, there are a lot. I loved every time where there's an event from the books where a character does something, and then we see in Puffs that the action from that character was sparked by Wayne doing something. Like Wayne crashing into Ginny and convincing Ginyto throw the diary into the toilet.
Christina Kann 55:34
Mats Furuli 55:34
And also when he convinces Cedric to ask Cho out to the Yule Ball.
Lelia Hilton 55:45
Mats Furuli 55:46
What's the what's the last one I'm thinking? in year five, when Dumbledore comes in, and he's like, "Hey, so have you seen Harry? I'm thinking about maybe explaining some things about his past and why I've been avoiding him." And Wayne's just like, "Yeah, I haven't seen him." "Okay, I guess we'll just wait until the end of the year."
Christina Kann 56:10
Wayne is just like shit-faced and is like, "No, I haven't fucking seen him." Um, I really liked the bit where -- this is such a classic comedy bit. Just the juxtaposition when Voldemort is doing his scary loud voice thing over all of Hogwarts and he's like, "Bring Harry to me." And then he keeps talking and he doesn't realize he's still on loudspeaker.
Mats Furuli 56:45
He's like "Did anyone bring any board games? Or snacks?"
Christina Kann 56:51
That actor's performance of Voldemort reminded me so much of Him from Powerpuff Girls. Do y'all know who I'm talking about?
Lelia Hilton 57:00
No, but Haley said something about that, too.
Christina Kann 57:03
Ooh! Haley, this one's for you, babe. Okay, well, I'll put a clip in the show notes. Go check out Him. I it's the voice. It's the voice, it's very like, *lofty voice* "Oh, wow, well well well." I feel like that also sounded like I was trying to do a McGonagall impression.
Lelia Hilton 57:23
It's kind of like when any of us try to do any accent as well. *terribly British accent* "Oh, oh, wicked good, biscuits, tea and biscuits.
Christina Kann 57:36
Oh my god. Lelia, what was your favorite crossover moment?
Lelia Hilton 57:41
I can't get this out of my head. I already talked about; I wish I didn't. But the stupid screaming cup. Goddammit. I mean, I'd like I think I might have peed from laughing so hard. It's that funny. It's just like a clever joke, a really simple joke, it's so simple that like, I wish I had thought of it.
Christina Kann 58:03
Yes! And there's a lot of jokes like that in this play, where it's just a split second. And if you miss it, it's fine. But like, you're gonna miss them if you're not paying attention. This was a no-devices viewing. Just me and the TV, eye contact for two straight hours.
Lelia Hilton 58:21
I agree. I thought about taking notes and then I was like, "Yeah, no, I need to be here. I gotta be here and present."
Christina Kann 58:27
Yeah, well, here I didn't even -- let me pull up my fucking notes, because I did write them, and I pulled them up for this. Here's my notes. Okay. "Year one :Harry Potter is super cute. Emo Puff Megan. Herbology is awesome. Is Ron a broom?" I don't know why I like -- obviously Ron was a mop. I don't know why my brain was like "broom broom broom." Okay, my next note is "Puff formation number four. We are not a threat. Please be our friend." Which, I love that so much. I feel like that's me walking into the bathroom at like a concert. You know, and I'm like, "I'm not a threat. Please be my friend."
Lelia Hilton 59:04
Yes. Haley actually said perhaps that should be what we chant when we have new guests on the pod.
Christina Kann 59:15
Okay, here's the fun note. This play took time for weird asides, which I feel like is very Puffy. Huffy Puffy. You know what I mean? Like they got off on tangents just to make us giggle. And that feels like a bunch of stoned Hufflepuffs in a room trying to tell a story, you know?
Lelia Hilton 59:31
Christina Kann 59:32
Yeah. I'm almost done with my notes, don't worry.
Mats Furuli 59:36
I have so many notes.
Christina Kann 59:39
Well Mats, you'd seen this before. I should have watched it a couple times and then tried to eventually take notes, but the plot doesn't matter really, because you already are familiar with the plot. It's just the Hufflepuff version. So my next note is Cedric's quote about failing. "Failure is just another form of practice as long as you never stop trying." And I fucking love that big Puff energy.
Lelia Hilton 1:00:02
I think I think I did like get a little emotional when he said that.
Christina Kann 1:00:06
Lelia Hilton 1:00:07
I love that.
Christina Kann 1:00:09
Absolutely. Okay, so I guess the end of my notes is, is when I was like, "Okay, I'm only gonna write down the really good stuff." Okay, I like how in Puffs of the bar is set so low, that progress is so achievable, which I feel like is really relatable. If we're just aiming for third place, you know what I mean? First place, that's kind of a lot, and we're setting ourselves up for disappointment. But like, third place? Now that -- that we could do. The tempering of expectations. And then my final note from this viewing is, "We all find that part of us: the Puff," and I don't even remember the context, but I wrote it down. And so I guess it moved me. We all find that part of us. The Puff.
Lelia Hilton 1:00:57
Yeah. And I think we do. I think everyone has a little bit of Puff in them. And if not, you're a psychopath.
Mats Furuli 1:01:03
Christina Kann 1:01:03
I was going to say sociopath. Yeah, absolutely. And I think that a lot of people, at least in my life, are becoming like more Puff as we grow older. Learning how to communicate, learning that your personal relationships are a priority, and you have to nurture them, like a plant so that they grow in the sun.
Lelia Hilton 1:01:27
So Sprouty of you.
Christina Kann 1:01:30
So is there anything that we haven't covered yet? Anything either one of you would like to touch on before we wrap this up?
Mats Furuli 1:01:35
I mean, I have over three pages of notes. So if I were to --
Christina Kann 1:01:39
Okay, lay it on me.
Mats Furuli 1:01:41
One of the very opening lines is just very fitting. "If you find yourself in need of using the loo make sure you make a big show of it." All about drama!
Lelia Hilton 1:01:53
Mats Furuli 1:01:56
Also, yeah, freak chocolate frog accident? All caps and three question marks.
Christina Kann 1:02:02
Oh, yeah. Who was that? Wayne's his parents died in a freak chocolate frog accident. Oh, that's the Puffest shit. Wait, I didn't even mention that Wayne was raised by his uncle in New Mexico or Arizona. What was it?
Mats Furuli 1:02:18
The land of Cattle Poke Springs, New Mexico.
Christina Kann 1:02:23
New Mexico. And Wayne gets his letter, and he's like, "Uncle Dave, like, what is this?" and his uncle's like "Oh fuck. I definitely meant to tell you about that."
Mats Furuli 1:02:33
"Uncle Dave, there's a bird in the living room." And Uncle Dave's like "What kind of bird?" "Uh, an owl, I think." "Oh, fuck."
Christina Kann 1:02:48
I love Uncle Dave. He did his best.
Lelia Hilton 1:02:50
Mats Furuli 1:02:51
And the next one is Blundering Wimpersnatch. Is that a Benedict Cumberbatch joke?
Christina Kann 1:02:57
Oh, oh my god. That's funny. Definitely.
Mats Furuli 1:03:01
I love the fact that Mirror of Erisedis just called Rorrim Driew, which is just "weird mirror" spelled backwards.
Christina Kann 1:03:10
Okay, these are some details I've never noticed.
Lelia Hilton 1:03:12
Christina Kann 1:03:14
We'll have to look for these next time, Lelia.
Mats Furuli 1:03:15
Some of the spell names are phenomenal, like Rickman-Sempra instead of "rictusempra." "Expelli-dermis," when Mr. Voldy just rips off the fucking band aid or whatever he's got over his nose. And "Olive Gardium leviosa."
Christina Kann 1:03:37
Yes, that one's stuck in my memory forever.
Lelia Hilton 1:03:40
What's the one where he kept generating doves?
Mats Furuli 1:03:43
Oh, uh, fuck. It's like "Aviforus" or something like that? Yeah,
Christina Kann 1:03:49
There was a couple magical moments in this that I could not explain scientifically. My eyes didn't move fast enough to figure out how this bird was getting around the stage. And there's one or two other things where I was like, "Damn, how did they do that?"
Mats Furuli 1:04:03
Oh my god. Same. Yeah, and the dueling club scene where Harry's like "No snake, please don't attack Justin," but unfortunately that's not what the rest of the school heard. It's like a fucking demon.
Christina Kann 1:04:23
He was like evidently speaking in tongues It is evil.
Lelia Hilton 1:04:31
He's like "No, snake! Don't hurt Justin!"
Mats Furuli 1:04:36
Also "real Mr. Moody costume." Yeah, it's Mad-Eye Moody. But he just tries to convince everyone that he's the real Mr. Moody. So I think his credited character name is "real Mr. Moody."
Lelia Hilton 1:04:54
Okay, real Professor Moody.
Christina Kann 1:04:57
I like that he literally just had a giant googly eye.
Lelia Hilton 1:05:05
But it worked like it. They pulled it off!
Christina Kann 1:05:08
It definitely worked. Yeah. And it made me laugh, a lot.
Mats Furuli 1:05:11
Same. Yeah. The next note is I really want a copy of Wayne's book on Fantastic Beasts. The fucking Balrog!
Christina Kann 1:05:22
Mats Furuli 1:05:24
Christina Kann 1:05:30
Oh, yeah. Because Wayne in his introduction, what is it? He's like, "Hi, I'm Wayne. I've read The Silmarillion a hundred times!"
Mats Furuli 1:05:35
"I've read The Silmarillion twice!"
Christina Kann 1:05:38
Twice? Well that is as impressive as 100 times. The Silmarillion is no joke.
Mats Furuli 1:05:43
I have not read The Silmarillion yet.
Christina Kann 1:05:44
Yeah. Me neither. Because it's no joke.
Mats Furuli 1:05:48
And when Cedric turns the book around, it's Paddington, and a Dalek from Dr. Who.
Christina Kann 1:05:54
Lelia Hilton 1:06:01
Christina Kann 1:06:02
Also, yeah. Wonder what kinds of dragons are in the book. Blue Eyes White Dragon, probably from Yu-Gi-Oh. Yeah, Wayne's like a straight up like nerd, dude. I fucking love it.
Mats Furuli 1:06:16
So good. And also I love that the play brought this up. Why the fuck did Cedric think that transfiguring a rock into a dog was a good idea when fighting the dragon. It's like, there's no fucking way this is going to end well. And the dragon just fucking bites the head off the dog.
Christina Kann 1:06:39
I forget who was like "There is now a dead dog on the field. There is a dead dog."
Mats Furuli 1:06:44
The Ludo Bagman character, played by the guy who plays Zack Smith.
Lelia Hilton 1:06:51
Mats Furuli 1:06:51
Yeah, the fact that the play's told from the point of view of Cedric's friends made Cedric's death absolutely heartbreaking.
Christina Kann 1:07:06
Yeah. I thought about bringing that up. And then I was like, too dark. Because right before the the intermission, too. You know how in the movie, the music is still playing, but like, you know, something is super wrong? It's like trauma, trauma, trauma. The feeling of that music, you can see it in their faces when he comes back. And then it just like fades off. And I'm sure when you're watching the show live, the lights just fade out, and it's like, intermission, have fun bitches. Absolutely. mortifying? Well, because they have no idea that anything is wrong. You know what I mean? Like, they don't have any of the context of the whole rest of the goddamn book.
Lelia Hilton 1:07:51
And I mean, they really just introduced Cedric to us in the fourth book, so we never really got time to know him in the books. Yeah, it was extremely sad for Harry when he died because they became friends. But we as the audience really got to know him, like from day one. So it's just like, I'm like, "No, he's gone." But it's okay. Because he comes back as Voldemort.
Mats Furuli 1:08:20
Also, I'd do anything for a Puff hug right now.
Christina Kann 1:08:25
Oh, yeah! Two of them would hug, and then the other would say "Coming in!" So cute.
Mats Furuli 1:08:35
Adorable. And yeah, which kind of Voldemort is the worst? The one that never shows affection or the overly affectionate one?
Christina Kann 1:08:43
Oh, yeah! Wait, that's a great -- Okay, wait, I'm changing my favorite joke from the movie to this. Because everyone makes fun of the infamous Voldemort-Draco hug, but in this he's lik -- to some random Death Eater -- he's like, "Let me show that I'm grateful with my physical affection" and starts giving him a hug and a neckrub.
Mats Furuli 1:09:05
*laughing so hard he's kindda choking* It goes on for so long.
Christina Kann 1:09:10
It's like kind of bit where it's like it's funny, and then it's not funny, and then it starts being funny.
Lelia Hilton 1:09:14
Cuz it goes on that long.
Christina Kann 1:09:17
It really was very intense physical affection.
Lelia Hilton 1:09:21
He kisses his hand at one point. Yeah, he like down and kneels and kisses his hand!
Mats Furuli 1:09:26
I thought about bringing that up when we were talking about Harry kissingWayne's shoulder.
Christina Kann 1:09:32
Mats Furuli 1:09:36
AOL Instant Messenger.
Christina Kann 1:09:38
Lelia Hilton 1:09:39
That was cute.
Christina Kann 1:09:41
Yeah. One summer Wayne gets sick of owls and is like, "We're doing AIM now."
Mats Furuli 1:09:45
Yeah, it's it's because of the ministry intercepting mail.
Christina Kann 1:09:53
Oh, yeah. Very smart.
Mats Furuli 1:09:55
Lelia Hilton 1:09:56
They don't know about that internet.
Mats Furuli 1:09:59
I do wonder how I'm making content though.
Lelia Hilton 1:10:02
Christina Kann 1:10:03
Mats Furuli 1:10:06
Next note is "Yippee kay-aye, mother-puffer."
Christina Kann 1:10:11
Loved it. Yes.
Mats Furuli 1:10:13
Yeah. I love the fact that the Death Eaters are called Death Buddies.
Lelia Hilton 1:10:21
I think I missed that!
Mats Furuli 1:10:24
Also, yeah. Mr. Voldy and the Death Buddies would make a great band name.
Christina Kann 1:10:28
Yes. Well, I think that the Death Buddies, once again, sounds like a Hufflepuff who didn't hear it right. And it's just like, I don't know, it's just him and his Death Buddies. I don't know.
Lelia Hilton 1:10:41
They're all friends, I guess. Like, why else would they all be together?
Mats Furuli 1:10:47
It's definitely not a racist cult or anything.
Lelia Hilton 1:10:49
Mats Furuli 1:10:53
Yeah, and the last note is, I can't believe that this play actually made me care about characters like Ernie McMillan and Justin Finch-Fletchley.
Christina Kann 1:11:01
Yeah. Yeah. Puffs are, like, endearing. You know, like the puffs are, it's like, you just so want them to be happy and safe more than the stupid Gryffindors! Because it's like, when you walk directly into the fire, it's like yeah, you're gonna fucking get burned, you fucking idiot. Like, Harry, why are you doing this? But with the Puffs, this is just their home and they're just trying to be happy. I really did weep at the end when they all come together because it has such a different energy than the Gryffindors. You know what I mean? Like Harry, Ron, and Hermione are not even with the Gryffindors during the final battle because they're too busy each being dramatic spotlight heroes, you know what I mean? It's like we're not even together. Puffs! Puffs. I freakin love em.
Lelia Hilton 1:11:58
Yeah. In that last scene, when the Death Eaters are just Avada Kadavra-ing everyone left and right -- it's a very reverent -- it's a very big shift in tone. Well, it really kind of happens for sure when Cedric dies. And then from there, I mean, we still get tons of hilarious bits and jokes and silly bits. But then the tone has shifted to a much more like reverent space. And it's almost like -- I'm so sorry to keep quoting Hamilton --
Mats Furuli 1:12:32
Never apologize for quoting Hamilton.
Lelia Hilton 1:12:36
Thank you. And Hamilton's not nearly as silly as this. I wish it were. But it's like at the end of Hamilton, when like, it's a very sad ending. But at the same time, it's really sweet and heartwarming. And it just goes to show like, you never know, like, everyone's just living life. This isn't really one person's story and everyone's just living in it. Everyone has their own journey and their own perspective on this whole arc that we're all in.
Christina Kann 1:13:11
Yeah, absolutely. It's a team effort. Yes. It's like a family. They say, you know, McGonagall or whatever, says, "Your house will be like your family while you're at Hogwarts." And I feel like, for the Puffs, it's way more true. You know what I mean?
Lelia Hilton 1:13:28
Yeah, they took those words extremely seriously.
Mats Furuli 1:13:31
And the Gryffindors did not.
Christina Kann 1:13:34
Yeah. The Gryffindors exist in each other's space, but they don't act like a family, not even the family members.
Mats Furuli 1:13:40
I guess Fred and George, kind of. I feel like by like being the loudest, they kind of brought everyone together to just laugh at them.
Christina Kann 1:13:52
That's my technique also! Oh my god. There was one Fred and George quote that I tweeted a couple weeks ago that was so relatable. It was like "Fred and George were dealing with the the added stress by being louder and more boisterous than ever," and I was like, they understand me.
Lelia Hilton 1:14:09
There you are there! There she is.
Christina Kann 1:14:11
I think if Fred and George had not been Weasleys they would be in Hufflepuff.
Lelia Hilton 1:14:16
I was just thinking the same thing. I guess they play Quidditch and help fight and stuff, but--
Christina Kann 1:14:24
Hufflepuffs play Quidditch too.
Lelia Hilton 1:14:26
Yeah! And they've helped fight too.
Christina Kann 1:14:28
Mats Furuli 1:14:31
And, speaking of Quidditch. Hufflepuff out of four games Gryffindor played Hufflepuff, Hufflepuff won three. So ha!
Lelia Hilton 1:14:42
Mats' got numbers! We got stats!
Christina Kann 1:14:46
Puffs Puffs Puffs! We started this episode by talking about how much we all hate sportsball.
Lelia Hilton 1:14:52
It's true. And here we are. Full Circle. A bunch of hypocrites.
Christina Kann 1:14:57
You know what? Hufflepuff is good at Quidditch because they're team players.
Mats Furuli 1:15:01
Lelia Hilton 1:15:03
I gotta say, yeah, as somebody who has input into who gets hired in my company that I work for, I would much more go for somebody who is a team player and maybe not a rock star employee. So like, yeah, a Hufflepuff. A Gryffindor is great. They're a rock star, and they're like going to the top, but maybe they're not really paying attention to how their coworkers are drowning.
Christina Kann 1:15:25
Interpersonal shit. Absolutely.
Lelia Hilton 1:15:27
Yeah. So be more of a Hufflepuff everyone.
Mats Furuli 1:15:30
Christina Kann 1:15:31
I mean, I gotta agree. Yeah, like be more Huff. Be more Puff. I've always said "Huff" but I'm trying to train myself to say "Puff" because it has meaning to me now. Also Puff Puff Pass.
Lelia Hilton 1:15:44
Exactly. It's all connected. They didn't do any overt weed jokes. I was a little sad about that.
Christina Kann 1:15:52
I was pretty impressed. I don't think I would have been able to avoid the weed jokes.
Lelia Hilton 1:15:57
That would have been my first joke I like write down. Like, "I don't know. Puff, puff, pass? Put that in there, I guess."
Christina Kann 1:16:07
Are y'all ready to wrap up?
Lelia Hilton 1:16:08
Yeah, I think so.
Mats Furuli 1:16:09
Christina Kann 1:16:10
Okay. All right. Lelia, do you want to tell people where they can find you online?
Lelia Hilton 1:16:14
Sure thing. If you want to find me online, I'm on Instagram and Twitter as @leelz4realz.
Christina Kann 1:16:29
That's linked in the show notes.
Lelia Hilton 1:16:30
Linked in the show notes. And you can find me most Sundays talking about movies with my friends in the Movie Night Crew.
Christina Kann 1:16:37
Hell yeah. And what's something you've been watching, reading, playing, observing, philosophizing recently that you think our listeners would enjoy?
Lelia Hilton 1:16:47
Sure. So this is a little off brand for our listenership. So I don't know who would be interested. But I really enjoy this comedy podcast called This Is Important. Tina, I was talking to you a little bit about it. It's created by the four guys who did Workaholics, so Blake Anderson, Adam Devine, and Kyle Newacheck and Anders Holm. And it's literally those four guys just shooting the shit. They did improv comedy with very esteemed improv groups for a long time and they've been working together and just have been friends forever. So it's just like a really funny, wholesome podcast where dudes just kind of joke on each other. And it has me like laughing so hard, I'm crying. It comes out every single Tuesday and they put one out every week for free on Spotify. So I highly recommend if you are at all a fan of workaholics, or if you're like "I'm not really into that type of humor," you might be surprised. Maybe give it a try.
Christina Kann 1:17:53
Yeah, give it a try. Puff energy. Mats, what about you? Do you want people to connect with you on the internet?
Mats Furuli 1:17:59
I mean, sure. Yeah. You can find me on Twitter and Instagram @mdotfur.
Christina Kann 1:18:10
I do love it. That's how you sign your emails too. And what's something that you would like to recommend to our listeners?
Mats Furuli 1:18:18
Well, I've not really been watching anything recently other than Puffs and Hamilton, but--
Christina Kann 1:18:25
You could do an old favorite too.
Mats Furuli 1:18:27
Sure. Yeah, I'm gonna plug Hamilton.
Mats Furuli 1:18:31
It is wonderful. I watched it this morning for the 34th time.
Christina Kann 1:18:38
Oh, my God. I'm impressed that you're still keeping track at this point.
Lelia Hilton 1:18:41
Mats Furuli 1:18:42
I think yesterday was my 10th. time watching Puffs. Yeah, I'm getting pretty high up in terms of numbers for that one as well.
Christina Kann 1:18:55
I need to catch up.
Mats Furuli 1:18:59
I feel like everyone at this point knows about Hamilton, and there's not really a whole lot to say about it. It's a phenomenal musical. Written and starring Lin Manuel Miranda, who wrote music for, for example, Moana, which is one of my absolute favorite movies. Probably my favorite Disney movie.
Christina Kann 1:19:27
We were fighting about this in the Discord recently.
Mats Furuli 1:19:29
Yeah. I love Frozen, I love Tangled, but Moana--
Christina Kann 1:19:35
That's the trifecta.
Mats Furuli 1:19:36
Christina Kann 1:19:37
If you want to be part of our Discord conversations, you can join The Restricted Section Patreon! For as little as $1 a month you can hang out with the gang.
Lelia Hilton 1:19:46
We're really nice and fun.
Christina Kann 1:19:48
Yeah! Puffs! Yeah, I fully second the Hamilton plug. For sure. It's so good. The last time I watched it was with you, Lelia, and we were just weeping and looking at Grace to make sure she was enjoying it as much as we wanted her to.
Lelia Hilton 1:20:07
Christina Kann 1:20:08
Yeah, update: she was.
Lelia Hilton 1:20:10
Update: she was.
Christina Kann 1:20:10
So I've been your host Christina you can follow me on Instagram @christinathekann. You can follow me on Twitter @christina_kann. Tou can follow me on TikTok @sproutsprivatestash. And this week I would like to recommend-- Because you just mentioned Lin Manuel Miranda, I'm gonna recommend the His Dark Materials series, which I think is an Amazon Prime original. And Lin Manuel Miranda is in it. He plays a character that's called the Texan, which I find to be very endearing. So he's a little bit of like a gun slinging aeronaut with a basically like a pet rabbit. It's like very endearing, just him in a hot air balloon with his bunny being like, *southern accent* "What the heck is going on?" The whole plot of His Dark Materials is much more complex than that. It involves the space-time continuum and the meaning of death. So it's pretty heavy. And then the book series is great too. I recommend them. Lelia! Mats! Thank you guys so much for coming and Puffing it up with me.
Mats Furuli 1:21:17
Thank you so much for having me.
Lelia Hilton 1:21:19
Christina Kann 1:21:19
Mats, I could not have dreamed of doing this without you. So thanks for being our guide to the world of Puffs. I think that me and Lelia are both feeling really seen right now.
Lelia Hilton 1:21:29
We are! And not only that -- I don't know about you, Tina, but I had never even heard about this before. And I had no idea that there was a platform where it was recorded where we could just watch it. So thank you so much, Mats.
Christina Kann 1:21:41
Oh yeah, I guess I should have said at the top of the episode -- I'll say it now in case anyone made it this fucking far and still is like "Maybe I should go watch it." It's available. I think it was available through Amazon to rent for like $3 or whatever.
Lelia Hilton 1:21:55
It's worth it.
Mats Furuli 1:21:56
It's also on Broadway HD if you have an account there. If not, it's also fairly cheap and also a hundred percent worth it.
Lelia Hilton 1:22:09
And if you only want to see Puffs, they have a free trial period that you can just start and just watch Puffs and stop. But you shouldn't, because Broadway is awesome.
Christina Kann 1:22:19
Yeah, true. True. Um, yeah, I'm just so glad that we got to go on this journey together. I feel stronger because we're together and I'm just happy to be here with you. Oh, love you guys!
Puffs! Puffs! Puffs!
Lelia Hilton 1:22:38
We are not a threat!